Speaker 1 00:00:20 Welcome to another episode of the Cosmic Cafe, the podcast for the cosmic circus.com. I'm ala Ruby, and today is all about the Mysterious Benedict Society. I spoke with Chrissy Car's Chenko, the Second Season's costume designer. If you're a fan of the Disney Show, you're gonna wanna have a listen. Enjoy.
Speaker 2 00:00:39 It's wonderful to meet you. Um, so I thank you here. I'm ala I write for the Cosmic Circus. Um, and why don't you tell me a little bit about yourself?
Speaker 3 00:00:49 Um, well, I'm Chrissy Caris. Um, I am a costume designer and I design, uh, for episodic TV primarily. I also design for live performance stage and for opera. And I'm also a professor at U C L A for costume design.
Speaker 2 00:01:07 Hey, that's wonderful. I'm a student at U C L A in my free time, um, so that No way. Yeah. Are you here in Los
Speaker 3 00:01:14 Angeles?
Speaker 2 00:01:15 No, no. I'm actually in the DC area. I'm in at U C L A extension for screenwriting. So I
Speaker 3 00:01:21 Amazing. I
Speaker 2 00:01:22 Love the program there. Um, so can you talk a little bit about your approach to, you know, this season? Um, you know, do you, what is your philosophy for, for the season, I guess?
Speaker 3 00:01:34 Oh, I love that. First I'm gonna give a, um, a shout out to season one was designed by Kate Adair. Mm-hmm. <affirmative>. Um, and what's incredible is that she set the tone at a very high sophisticated level where it's got this beautiful color palette. It's sort of a heightened reality. Um, it's kind of like a whimsical, nostalgic nod to the sixties and seventies mm-hmm. <affirmative>. But it's what my students, uh, call, uh, s miriad. You know, it's kind of a mashup. You can't tell what period anything is in. Um, so for, uh, this season what was really incredible, uh, was how collaborative the process was. I loved working with these writers, uh, Todd, Phil, Darren, Matt, and also Craig Zisk, who was our director for some of the episodes, but also, uh, one of the producers. And it was just great to keep working with them so that we just kept moving things up a little more heightened, a little more magical little, uh, unique color story. Um, but then Craig would kind of push it back down a little. Like, okay, there's like this, we don't wanna tip the balance. So that was really special.
Speaker 2 00:02:53 Um, now do you look at the screenplays and read the screenplays ahead of time when you're designing or, you know, what, what kind of is, is the process from
Speaker 3 00:03:02 The process? So the very first thing was when, um, Kate de Dare asked if I would consider interviewing for the project. Mm-hmm. <affirmative>, because she went on to Par, HBO's, Perry Mason. Yeah. And the timing wasn't working and we're very good friends. And she was like, could you consider taking this beautiful jewel of a project? I was like, well, lemme take a look. I was on Barry for H b o mm-hmm. <affirmative>, um, talk about night and day. Totally different stories and totally different aesthetics. But I was a little done with the violence factor. I was like, looking for something more artistic and creative. Yeah. So, um, the very first thing was I went and watched all of the episodes of season one. I think I had a day to prep for my interview with the producers. And, um, as soon as we, so I put together a little pitch packet of where, um, where the story could go with the kids being a couple of years older.
Speaker 3 00:04:01 Um, met with them as soon as I landed the job. The very next thing was I bought the books <laugh>, and then I was like reading the books and my commute is terrible. So it was also listening to them on tape. Mm-hmm. <affirmative> trying to get through the first two books. Um, but it's a little tricky 'cause the story is inspired by the books. Right. But it's not exactly parallel to the books. Um, and then from there that trying to get into that deep dive of what they created in season one and how to stay in that same rabbit hole to then design the next season.
Speaker 2 00:04:39 What do you think are the main differences, you know, tonally or, or anything else between season one and, and season two? What, um, was there like a mandate from the, from the production designer,
Speaker 3 00:04:50 From the, no, but there was a big shift. Mm-hmm. <affirmative>, season one was filmed beautifully in Vancouver mm-hmm. <affirmative>. And it's foggy and it's misty and the, all your exteriors have sort of that gray tone. And then they saturated the buildings and the characters. So that has a whole, the cinematography is totally different because season two we filmed in Los Angeles, which was great. Um, and we also, the story shifts. They season one, they were at a school and now the story, they're gonna be getting onto a ship. Mm-hmm. <affirmative> across the Atlantics. You're not supposed to know we're in Los Angeles, <laugh>. And then you go across the ship. And then we are in Europe and it's un uh, non-specific locations in Europe. Oh, we did do, um, Portugal.
Speaker 2 00:05:44 Right.
Speaker 3 00:05:44 Portugal. Yeah. Yeah. And fortunately I had, um, spent quite a bit of time in Portugal because, um, I designed an opera there. So when they were talking about that port and coming in, I knew exactly what they were talking about was kind of wonderful. And it's like, oh, and the uniforms for the police are so different mm-hmm. <affirmative>. And then we created all the, the different uniforms for the customs brokers and the agriculture people and the local police. But the, um, Craig Sis and the rest of the writers were like, but don't make it threatening. So, you know, we, we soften the tone. Mm-hmm. <affirmative> of the authorities when you get to Portugal.
Speaker 2 00:06:25 Um, now I read, actually that goes into my next question. Very well. I think I read that on another project you worked on, you did location research in Houston for it. Now did you get to go, um, did you make any trips to Europe for this or did you rely on that research of, from having been to Portugal or anywhere else?
Speaker 3 00:06:43 So fortunately, uh, because I've been doing so much opera, I've been going to Europe a lot except during the pandemic. Mm-hmm. So two years I was not on an airplane, which is very rare 'cause I was on an airplane at least once a month. Um, and a lot of it going to Europe. But, um, uh, so no, and I think first, I think what it is, is that I designed big love that takes place in Utah. I think that's where you
Speaker 2 00:07:11 Might have seen that may have been Okay. Yeah.
Speaker 3 00:07:13 So I designed Big love for H B O and, um, seven years, five seasons. Um, you better believe I did get in my car and I did drive and tried to get into those compounds.
Speaker 2 00:07:26 Yeah.
Speaker 3 00:07:26 Yeah. I like that. Firsthand research. I got driven off the compound. Oh. But I then went to like, well, where did these women go shopping? So I went over to, I think it's called St. George, and I went to the Sure enough at the Walmart,
Speaker 2 00:07:42 The same stuff there
Speaker 3 00:07:43 I was with my camera, like, you know, holding it close, I'm taking the pictures. It was before our cell phones. <laugh>. Yeah. Yes, I did do that.
Speaker 2 00:07:51 No.
Speaker 3 00:07:52 Um, and then they reached out, which is really great. And I then was able to collaborate with some of the, uh, the people who used to be members of that compound. Oh,
Speaker 2 00:08:03 That's phenomenal. So, you know, speaking of sourcing and kind of, um, pulling everything together to, you know, achieve these, um, you know, achieve these, uh, looks that elevate the story, um, what did you, like, how was sourcing it for this project? Do you know? Did you, was there a lot of sewing? Was there, um, oh yeah. You know, stuff from thrift stores. How did, what was that process like
Speaker 3 00:08:27 For the main cast, because we needed multiples, we needed stunt, uh, um, outfits for them as well. Mm-hmm. <affirmative>, we had to put harnesses under some of them. Some of them they got dirty. Um, yeah. But we had stunts and we had photo doubles for all the kids. Mm-hmm. <affirmative>. 'cause they have a limited amount, amount of time. So that's sort of the practical parts of it. But the most important, starting a project like this is what is the color palette? Yeah. What's that color story? And working very closely with the production designer. Mm-hmm. So that we are symbiotic with this Cynthia Sherette. Um, but we had one, one given that Kristen Shaw's character number two, uh, got her name because of her lineup with the kids, but it also referred to the number two pencil.
Speaker 2 00:09:19 Ah,
Speaker 3 00:09:20 Right. So all of her clothes are keyed off of yellow and a very specific yellow of a number two pencil. And then the accents are the color of the, the eraser that kind of burnt orange. And then the green lettering on the classic old school. Number two, uh, we also infused into her costume. Oh,
Speaker 2 00:09:44 That's a wonderful detail.
Speaker 3 00:09:45 Yeah. So, because I knew that she, her composition needed to be all about a number two pencil. Everybody else's costumes then work in the same hue and the value on the color wheel. So nobody could be in yellow or if they were in yellow, it was very specific mm-hmm. <affirmative>. And then I'm constantly thinking of what is that composition of the four kids mm-hmm. <affirmative>, what is the composition of the four kids and the four adults with the, um, who were sort of the, what are they, the the chaperones of the kids? Yeah. Or orphans. Um, and then what is the composition for the, the background? And especially because we spend so much time on the shortcut ship, we created all of those uniforms for the shortcut. And we actually went back and we had access to the actual uniforms from the movie of Titanic.
Speaker 2 00:10:44 That's, uh, you, you, that's a perfect, uh, segue because I was going to ask about that. Because they feel like, you know, they look like they could have been from Titanic. They're so accurate. These, you know, what looked like naval uniforms almost. So,
Speaker 3 00:10:58 Um, we, we took, we went, we, we were constantly looking for what is the most nostalgic interpretation of each of these types of uniforms mm-hmm. <affirmative> characters. So that's why we went back like the most beautiful ship uniforms that audiences mm-hmm. <affirmative> will sort of know, or subliminally know. It's the way that, um, Deborah Scott designed those costumes for the Titanic. So what we did was we, um, we had the captain, he gets the three stripes mm-hmm. <affirmative>, and then we made with Cynthia, we made like the patch. Oh. Um, for the, um, for the whole line. So the, the line, it's the shortcut, but it's the green Zephyr lines.
Speaker 2 00:11:48 So that's the same as the ship in the air as well.
Speaker 3 00:11:51 Uh, that's the, the dirigible. The
Speaker 2 00:11:55 Dirigible, I'm sorry,
Speaker 3 00:11:56 <laugh>, but the Green Zephyr lines is like the Viking cruise lines. Mm-hmm. <affirmative> or, you know, so, or Cunard. Right. So the company, the, the, the hub, the corporate hub is Green Zephyr. So Cynthia came up with the logo with the, with the wind blowing the vessel, and it's green Zephyr. So then that's why we did the, the, those life jackets. And we printed the Green Zephyr. We made the, so we used vintage, um, sailor uniforms, but then we put green Zephyr on there. We put the sss shortcut on their sailor hats, like, um, Italian sailor hats. So it's kind of a mashup of everything. Right. Because it's a European line. Yeah. So we didn't have to be so, um, tethered to the US aesthetics for those uniforms. So we did these beautiful hats. They had the tassels, um, the back, I think we had signage on the back.
Speaker 3 00:12:57 Oh, we did the boiler suits, had the big, uh, silk screen of the, uh, the green Zephyr lines, because those, that crew can go from ship to ship. Yeah. You know, and, um, so it was the Captain Cannonball. Then there's all the sailors. Then there are the waiters all had the patch on their white waiters jackets, the bellboys, um, with the little bell hats, the, um, the people who were doling out the money and the ticket ticket agents green jackets when you first come up to the ticket booth. Yeah. It was huge. It was so exciting to do it. That was so thrilling. Um, one was creating the color palette of my principles, like starting with the yellow for number two, then constances in pink, and then figuring out where I could fit everybody else's color story in the, in the color wheel, so that they all look beautiful when they all come together at the end.
Speaker 2 00:13:56 Was there anything that was really challenging to kind of figure out and, you know, put together Yes.
Speaker 3 00:14:01 Timing. We never have enough. There's never in tv there's never enough time. I mean, it's so fast. Every 10 days you're on a new script with a new director, you know, and, and we're all over the, the distance and the driving and all of that. But it, it really comes together when it's great communication with your producer writers, with my production designer. But then I have an amazing costume team. I had, um, my core team was 16 at any given time. Oh, wow. They made all of the costumes for the main cast. All of that was made in house. Um, and then you have like, working with the actors and they're so excited to collaborate and to create costumes in the fittings. I mean, that's the best. The kids were amazing. They're so bright and astute, and they're just like, yeah, I love that. And then I had like, um, Kate the Great, I wanna be an Orange. I'm like, <laugh> orange. It's, we could make that happen, you know, and then putting a spin on everything. But the kids were very much involved with that pro. We would show them the drawings. Mm-hmm. <affirmative>, um, take their feedback because I also want them to take ownership mm-hmm. <affirmative> as their character, so that when they're wearing those clothes, they feel like they are embodying their character.
Speaker 2 00:15:23 I love that. Now can you talk a little bit about working with Tony Hale? 'cause as you know, as you know, he's got two characters. Yeah. And it, it's gotta be an interesting thing, right. To design for the same person with two characters.
Speaker 3 00:15:37 It's amazing. <laugh> Tony is amazing. What an amazing performance, right. To play the characters. And very few times would we have a photo double Tony's just like, oh, I can talk to, I can talk to the void that is supposed to be my mother's character, you know? But the only time we had the doubles was for the long shots when they pull away to show both of them in the scene. Mm-hmm. <affirmative>, you know. Um, but otherwise it's incredible. I mean, even in the fitting room, uh, for, for, for his character, um, Benedict, we used all the same clothes from season one. Mm-hmm. <affirmative> just a little bit of a mashup. But that character isn't somebody who would be a clothes horse and have a ton of clothes. He's a professor type who like has his one look and a couple of ties and a couple of shirts.
Speaker 3 00:16:32 Um, so that one we just had to tweak things to make it more comfortable. But it's amazing in the fitting room, Tony, you watch him morph <laugh> into, um, into Benedict where he slouches and he kind of puts up his face and he kind of twist his neck a little bit. It's amazing. Wow. And then that comes off and he is like, you know, he's full Tony Hale. And then, um, you know, five minutes later he's in curtain and his, his shoulders are upright and his head is upright and trying to get height on his neck. Mm-hmm. <affirmative>. Um, it's incredible. Just incredible to watch that.
Speaker 2 00:17:12 Now Curtain has evolved a little bit from last season two in, in this season. So did that change kind of his look at all, or, or the, the palette for his
Speaker 3 00:17:20 Yeah, a bit. A bit. Um, we, we stuck with that blue mm-hmm. Teal blue palette. Some, some blue grays. Um, but we wanted to embrace sort of a zen we were working with trying to infuse his look and his character's, uh, upper class, uh, sartorial aesthetics. Mm-hmm. <affirmative> with an Asian element. He wanted to bring in some kind of zen quality to the character. So we were playing with a, um, sort of a nod to an Asian collar into blazers. It was tricky. It was really hard. And my, even my Korean tailor kind like, I don't know, but we, we got there, but it was a little, it was a little difficult. Sometimes the ideas have a hard time translating into getting the fabric to behave. Right. <laugh>.
Speaker 2 00:18:17 Ah, yeah.
Speaker 3 00:18:18 Yeah. But it was tricky. But, um, yeah, we wanted sort of that whimsy, but Asian infused with European clothing.
Speaker 2 00:18:27 Okay. Um, you know, were there any kind of Easter eggs, costume wise or or design wise that, you know, you can, that you can talk about or slipped in there? Um, you know, any nods to anything that, you know, kind of special
Speaker 3 00:18:42 Darn <laugh>? I, you know, I know all my, um, you know, I teach, so I was telling you, I teach at U C L A mm-hmm. <affirmative>, and most of my graduate alumni and undergrad alumni, most of them work in DC and Marvel. Mm-hmm. <affirmative> because they have such great, uh, training in computers and, uh, unique fabric sourcing and all that. So they talk about this Easter egg thing a lot. <laugh>. I never thought about it. <laugh>. I don't, I don't.
Speaker 2 00:19:17 That's fine too.
Speaker 3 00:19:19 Yeah. I know they do it like in, um, Vission, they have a bunch of them.
Speaker 2 00:19:25 Oh, I, I, I know people talk about them online. So I, I believe it. Um, is there anything, I guess
Speaker 3 00:19:32 I need to like, bring that into my, um, <laugh> visual vocabulary. I just haven't thought of it, but I just, I just interviewed the design team on Vission for my students. Oh. And, um, that came up quite a bit where they were talking about the Easter eggs, but I sadly have not thought about that as a designer. <laugh>.
Speaker 2 00:19:51 Well, next time I interview you, I'll ask you and I'll tell
Speaker 3 00:19:53 You where they're <laugh>.
Speaker 2 00:19:56 Um, you know, is there anything else you wanna share about, you know, season two, about the process or about your career or anything like that? Because I know we're coming on time.
Speaker 3 00:20:06 Yeah. Um, uh, no, but I just wanna say it's, it was just an incredible experience and I am, so my crew keeps calling me. I am so hoping we move on to season three because the show, you know, there's a new category in the Emmy's?
Speaker 2 00:20:25 No,
Speaker 3 00:20:26 It's for family children's programming. Oh. It just happened over the summer.
Speaker 2 00:20:32 It's about time <laugh>.
Speaker 3 00:20:33 Right. So I think it was a little late in the organization. I don't know. I'm not with the ME Academy. I am a member, but I don't know how they planned it. But, uh, they just announced last week, that season one has been nominated for 11 Emmy nominations in this new children's family. So
Speaker 2 00:20:54 That's phenomenal.
Speaker 3 00:20:55 Here. Benedict Society is going to be part of the lineup for the inaugural awards for family and, um, children's programming. I love that. And David Dare, the costume designer was also nominated. So hopefully they will look at our season two and consider all of us. But, um, you know, I wish them all the best of luck at the awards. I think it happens on December 10th and 11th this year. Okay.
Speaker 2 00:21:20 Well, I'll be watching and, and rooting for a third season and, and more costumes. Your work is beautiful and thank you so much for being here and, and talking with me. And, and thank you, Cameron. And
Speaker 3 00:21:31 Is your article written, do you want to, um, have images in the article?
Speaker 2 00:21:36 Oh, if you have images to share, that would be amazing. Usually I would just source 'em, but that's, that
Speaker 3 00:21:40 Would be, oh, no, I have Fantastic. I have. So, um, what I can do is I will share with you our renderings. Okay. I, uh, co-created the renderings with my illustrator Rashaun Lee. Okay. It's, um, I will put it in an email. Okay. And, uh, so we do, I normally do all of my drawings. Okay. But this show was so fast and we need so many renderings. Uh, then I worked with Rashan Lee, and what it was is that, um, most of the drawings are, they look like they are fitting photographs. Yeah. They were all created before the costumes were made. Wow. To have our writers producers approve the look of the show. Oh, wow. So, but it's really amazing when you see them, it looks like they are photographs. We even had moments where, uh, some of the producers were like, well, we have to move this scene up, and you've already got those coats ready. Right. And we're like, oh no, we don't even have the fabric finished.
Speaker 2 00:22:40 Oh, wow. They must be incredible. I can't wait to see them
Speaker 3 00:22:43 Really special. Yeah. Yeah. And that's all rash. I don't know how to do photorealism. I just do my little sort of surrealist drawings and Rashaan takes it and goes, bling, and it's all done, <laugh>. Oh, that's,
Speaker 2 00:22:56 That's phenomenal. Thank you. I'd love that. Welcome. Have a wonderful day.
Speaker 1 00:23:02 Thank you for listening. You can find the companion article for this podcast, along with all the other news for those who like superheroes, science fiction and fantasy films, TV shows, and other
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