Episode Transcript
Speaker 0 00:00:00 <silence>
Speaker 1 00:00:18 Welcome to the Cosmic Circle, your friendly neighborhood podcast. We are on the road to Quantum Mania. I'm your host. I live Ruby, and I'm here with Brian Kitson and Anthony Flagg. How are you guys tonight?
Speaker 2 00:00:30 Hey everyone, it's Brian Kitson. I'm excited to be here and ready to talk about the journey to Quantum Mania. Hey
Speaker 3 00:00:36 Y'all, it's Anthony Flagg and I've got some thoughts about Antman and I'm really excited to talk about him,
Speaker 1 00:00:42 So I'm so excited you guys are both here. We're here to talk about Antman and everything leading up to the new Antman movie that comes out on February 17th. And first of all, I'm just gonna get this out of the way. Antman is clearly the best Avenger, right?
Speaker 2 00:00:56 The best Avenger. Oh, I don't think Thor would agree with that <laugh>, but, um, he's definitely the most dynamic of the Avengers, I think is a safe way to put that
Speaker 3 00:01:09 In the sense that he can be both the biggest and the smallest adventure <laugh>, because that's what I was thinking. He's
Speaker 2 00:01:13 Got, that's exactly the way I was going.
Speaker 3 00:01:16 He's got variety,
Speaker 2 00:01:18 Right? He could be giant man or Antman and we've never actually called him Giant Man before, but, uh, I feel like we're having a missed opportunity here. But yeah, no, he's very sure why not. Best Avenger <laugh> confirmed by the Cosmic Circle <laugh>.
Speaker 3 00:01:34 He's probably my favorite personal Avenger, though. I've always liked Paul Rudd. I've seen him act for so long and, and it was just such an interesting thing. I'm like, Paul Rudd Ant Man. Sure, why not? <laugh>, the movies came out around my birthday, so I remember going to those with my friends and they're just great memories. So it's a little weird that we're gonna be watching this one in February, <laugh>, so it's a little different. I'm just used to those July, you know, birthday releases for me. They're so great. So mm-hmm. <affirmative>, I'm just, let's switch it up.
Speaker 2 00:02:01 It's, you know, you, you talked about those July movies, but not only that, but Amman has really been one of those refresher movies, um, which we can talk about as we go along, but like, they really are like pallet cleansers. And I, I don't think this one's gonna be the same, but I, I, I can't wait to see it.
Speaker 1 00:02:17 It looks so different than the other ones. And I don't remember what the other ones, the trailers were like, but this one just like, looks super dark in the latest trailers. And I think, actually, I think the first trailer that was released for Antman, um, was light and jokey, but the most recent one mm-hmm. <affirmative> did that come out today, like a couple days ago where, you know, you actually have Kang named and, you know, lots of screaming and, and anger and dramatic scenes. Was that, I mean, it just seems so different than the previous ones.
Speaker 3 00:02:47 First one was definitely a lot more comedic, light and tone, what we're used to in Ant Man. And, and like Brian said, they are palate cleansers. And it's nice because in between some of the bigger moments, you know, Antman one came out, what, right before Civil War. And then Aunt Man Two came out right before End Game, which arguably some of the most pivotal moments of M C U up until the point of the Infinity Saga. So like now we have him kicking off a whole phase that's gonna end with Kang. That's kind of crazy. Like we we're, we're starting with Ant Man, they wrapped up this last one with Black Panther, and that was heavy, emotional, strong. And now we're starting off with this and, and exploring the quantum realm. We've been to it briefly, but this time we're actually gonna stay there this time. I'm excited. Yeah.
Speaker 2 00:03:35 What's interesting about what you said is that it, Amman came before Civil War and Endgame, but it actually came in between two sets of major films mm-hmm. <affirmative>, because we had a vendor's age of Ultron before Antman followed by Antman and then Civil War on the other side. And then we had Avenger's Affinity War before Amman and the was, and then we had Captain Marvel, which is like an event and film, and then Avenger's end game. So like, it is like the, the cream to, uh, a Marvel Oreo here. And really, I think that you needed that for some of the way that these stories were told. You know,
Speaker 1 00:04:11 It really, the other movies just get so like dark. I think Antman really brings the lightness and, you know, all of the mm-hmm. <affirmative> the sagas. Absolutely. And it absolutely, I'm so glad you mentioned that. You know, this was kicking off a new phase, um, because there's lots to talk about with that. Um, so, but right now we're gonna talk about, you know, Antman in the past. So let's talk about your memories with the original Antman movie. Um, Anthony, you said, you know, you have birthday memories associated with it. Do you wanna talk about anything you really loved in that, that first Antman movie,
Speaker 3 00:04:46 Luis, but like, who doesn't love Luis? You know, it was just funny 'cause like you're starting off the movie. This dude's in jail. Like, we're, we're like, okay, he's in jail. He is getting out and, and what's he doing? He's a cat burglar. And then he turned out okay, he's actually, like, he fights the fight for the little guy. He has that scene there at the Basque Robbins where the manager's like, no, I know what you did. You really stuck into those big guys that like mm-hmm. <affirmative>, things like that were just so interesting. 'cause I love heists. Mm-hmm. <affirmative>, if, if you're a friend of mine, you know me, I love my Ocean's 11. I love all types of heists. So when I found out that like, hey, we're gonna be doing some thieving and some sneaking around and everything, oh man, I was on board, but during that time I wasn't like, that enveloped into Marvel, so I wasn't paying attention. It was just like, Hey, there's a movie. It's coming around around my birthday and I love going to the movies, so that's what I'm gonna go see. I'm gonna go see Ant-Man. Memories attached to that are just fantastic. Uh, I can't, it came out, what, 2016?
Speaker 2 00:05:40 2015? Mm-hmm.
Speaker 3 00:05:41 <affirmative> 2015. Okay. So I was, I was still living in, in Houston before I moved away and then moved back. So I was watching it with, with a good group of friends that enjoy the movies. So I love Antman and, and Paul Reddish is fantastic,
Speaker 2 00:05:54 You know, so for Amman, for me, my beginning for, uh, Marvel really began with Captain America Civil War. I'm pretty sure that's the first one I saw in theaters. Maybe I saw Thor the Dark World. Um, but up to that point, I had just like bought them and watched 'em at home, like very passively. And so for me, Antman was so different in theaters because it was so removed, even though it had some of the connective tissue, because like, like you said, Anthony, it was a heist movie. And up to this movie, you know, up to this film, we had had action films and we had had, you know, espionage and we had fantasy and space of travel. And this one was a very small film in that, no pun intended about him being Ant Man <laugh>, but like
Speaker 3 00:06:39 <laugh>,
Speaker 2 00:06:40 Like the Stake, the stakes weren't high in that. It didn't, the story didn't really impact anybody's life, but his and the other characters, like, it didn't, you didn't have the whole world about to end and you didn't have the, uh, what do they call it in the dark world, the convergence, like all of these big events. And New York wasn't on fire. This was about a dad trying to find stability for his daughter and trying to be a hero when everyone thought he was this villain because of some actions that he had done, and everybody judged him. And so like it for that, it felt like a very personal movie. And I liked that. It was kinda like the first time that I really felt that Marvel had tried something different and it succeeded <laugh>.
Speaker 1 00:07:22 Yeah. And in a lot of ways it was kind of his redemption because, you know, everyone essentially thought that he was just kind of this loser and he had nothing going on. Um, in his family, they thought that except for Cassie, um, you know, his ex-wife thought that, Paxton thought that, and you know, by the end of the movie, he's just, you know, he's this guy that they all respect and Cassie still believes in him. And I think that's Cassie's belief in him. And Cassie's, um, just relationship with him is something that, you know, is very important. Again, an ant-man in the Wasp. And it seems like it's gonna be very important in this new movie coming up. Um, and like you both said, it was a heist movie. I think, you know, it's, Marvel has something in every genre now it seems like. Um, I don't think we have a romcom yet, maybe coming up, um,
Speaker 2 00:08:08 Don't get them started. It'll be coming. <laugh>, Shing Chi. You could, you could argue is partially romcom, I mean Yeah,
Speaker 3 00:08:14 Yeah.
Speaker 2 00:08:15 The at least beginning part.
Speaker 1 00:08:17 <laugh>. Yeah. So this, this is Marvel's Oceans Elevens and mm-hmm. <affirmative>. It's just, you know, it's, it's fun and I really enjoyed it and I, so I didn't see it in theaters. I wish I had, um, I, I saw Captain America in theaters, the first one, and then I stopped watching Marvel movies, I think, until Homecoming was out on Netflix. And then
Speaker 3 00:08:39 I'm curious,
Speaker 1 00:08:40 Sorry, go ahead.
Speaker 3 00:08:41 No, no, no. You were talking, but I, I'm just curious, what was y'all's first M C U movie you saw in theaters? I know this is not on topic, but I just have to know this now.
Speaker 2 00:08:52 Uh, captain America Winner Soldier, I'm pretty sure it was, it was my first one. Um, I'm trying to think. You know, I was in high school until 2010, and then I think I got busy with college. So I think it was the Winter Soldier. I remember that one specifically. Um, because it, if I remember correctly, it came out not far from, um, spite the Amazing Spider-Man two. And I saw them pretty much like back to back. Mm-hmm.
Speaker 1 00:09:14 Yeah. It was the first Captain America for me as well. Um, really? Yeah. And I didn't like it at the time. I just thought that this was ridiculous and I, I never wanted to see another Marvel movie again until Spider-Man came out. So, yeah.
Speaker 2 00:09:26 And now you write for a website that focuses on Marvel.
Speaker 1 00:09:30 I, I, I was wrong. I, I, I missed a lot of good stuff. Sadly,
Speaker 3 00:09:35 My love affair with Marvel has been, been long going just, just for the listeners. I remember staying up till midnight to watch Iron Man two in theaters, and I had an exam the next morning, man, I, I, I don't know if y'all remember these, but they used to make, uh, Mount Mountain Dew used to make energy drinks called amp. Mm-hmm. <affirmative>. I drank like two or three of those the next morning. And I mean, I aced that test, but like, I still hold on more to the memories of watching Ironman in theaters with the AC d C and everything, but Yeah. But speaking of, well, I wouldn't say speaking of Ironman, but speaking of other characters in Marvel, it's funny you were mentioning earlier how small stakes, um, Antman is, because it's interesting to me that in the first Antman movie, where do we go? We go to the Stark compound to go steal stuff, and then who shows up? Falcon? Like, I honestly did not expect that to happen. Like, yeah, of course in a Marvel movie, someone is kind of bound to show up. I want to say, like, unless I'm wrong, black Widow would be like the only one where I don't think anybody else truly showed up, but that was more of a flashback. Well, who you got?
Speaker 2 00:10:45 I was gonna say a lot of the Marvel, I, the multiverse saga ones, I feel like didn't have. Like, I guess you sh it depends on how you look at it. Like Eternals didn't, and <laugh> Th Thor Love and Thunder, you could argue didn't, but I digress. Yeah, you're right. For the most, for the, for the most part. You're right there, Anthony.
Speaker 3 00:11:04 True, true. But I understand where you're coming from. At least those were like, connected in a different way. But in the sake of Anchorman, you're thinking, this guy's just kind of like doing this little own little thing in San Francisco at this point, like, the only California time we'd spent is with Tony Stark. Mm-hmm. <affirmative> in Malibu. Mm-hmm. <affirmative>. And then he moved over to New York and he was far removed from all that. And anyway, so like, who are you realistically gonna run into? So, and he, they're like, all right, we gotta go steal this thing from this little warehouse. And then you fly over and you see the stark compound, you're just like, crap, this is gonna end up poor. Like, this is gonna be bad <laugh>. And then he lands and shows up and who's there? Falcon ready to protect. And then who's on the comms? Captain America?
Speaker 1 00:11:44 Mm-hmm. <affirmative> and I, I just wanna say, because I totally forgot Iron Man was a Marvel movie, and my brain is fried. So Iron Man was what I first saw in theaters, and I really liked that until Captain America. Then I decided I was done with it. So sorry about that. <laugh>, um, be,
Speaker 2 00:12:00 Before we jump back to Aunt Man, I gotta know, do you feel different about Captain America the first Aven now that you are at all indoct into what the M C U is?
Speaker 1 00:12:10 I, it's not my favorite. Um, I like, you know, I like the scenes in the forties. I like all the Peggy Carter stuff. The Hydra stuff is just not, I just, I don't like it very much. It's weird. Um,
Speaker 2 00:12:23 We don't watch that movie for Captain America. We watch it for Peggy Carter. That's all. We are all watching it for <laugh>, all the Peggy Carter love <laugh>. Yeah,
Speaker 1 00:12:31 Exactly.
Speaker 2 00:12:32 That's, that's all. I'm here for <laugh>. Go back to Ant Man. <laugh>. Yeah.
Speaker 3 00:12:37 Right. An
Speaker 1 00:12:37 Man, I, I think we need a Peggy Carter podcast, just because there's so much to talk about
Speaker 2 00:12:44 Just for tuned to next episode.
Speaker 1 00:12:45 Exactly. So Ant Man, um, <laugh>, so, you know, after the first Antman movie, we see him in Civil War, and you know, he's, he's giant man. He is, he's recruited by the Falcon. He, you know, is is against Tony Stark and the other Avengers. What do you guys think of that? Um, you know, does that kind of fit his character?
Speaker 3 00:13:11 Absolutely.
Speaker 1 00:13:12 Do you like Giant Man?
Speaker 3 00:13:14 Oh, I just think that it fits his character. I mean, think about what he did in the firsthand man. He stuck it to those, you know, rich guys and everything. And he's thinking, oh look, here's a billionaire who's got toys to play with and everything, trying to tell other people how and what to do. And then I always think back to the little scene where later on he, he, he builds that report with Captain America and calls him ka and then later on in Endgame mm-hmm. <affirmative>, um, you know, she or, uh, wasp calls him Ka and she smiles because early on he is like, I I wanna say in, in the second one that he says that's what his friends call him. You know, they call him Cap and everything, but I dunno.
Speaker 2 00:13:52 So, you know, with Antman and Captain America Civil War, they came out like almost a year, but not quite, because Captain America came out in April or May. Um, we had like a really long period between Antman and Captain America to like, if you were me, you probably watched Ant Man quite frequently, <laugh>. Um, and so I loved having him in there and I think that he felt really, he fit in really well with the team that he was on. You know, captain, captain America's team all the way. Um, but it was a hundred percent who he was because he was always about doing the right thing. And like, you know, he has this theme of justice and trying to be a good person, even when sometimes that puts him in a difficult spot. And so, you know, he took on this, this mission knowing that it could potentially mess up his relationship with his daughter and like mess up at the relationship that with his ex-wife. And if, you know, how she would view this and the relationship with Wasp, like, which we see kind of play out in Aman, the wasps. And, you know, that actually gives me one of my favorite lines where, you know, he asked her if she would go and she's just like, we'll never find out. Like there's just so much that he put up for stake for that. And that's exactly who Scott is. He's always the person that's gonna do the right thing. And who's gonna say no to Captain America. Mm-hmm.
Speaker 3 00:15:14 <affirmative>. Yep. Yep.
Speaker 1 00:15:16 I think it's, I think both sides of, you know, of that in Civil War, both sides are justifiable. And I think that, you know, that, you know, Tony wanted to protect the world with armor, Sokovia, Accords, all of that. And then, um, you know, cap, obviously there were, there was a different point of view. But I think that if, you know, if Ironman had come to to Ant man, I think he would've said yes. Because again, he believes in doing the right thing. And I think he would've been able to see him, uh, like a justification for, you know, for fighting with them on that case.
Speaker 3 00:15:54 I disagree strongly, actually, really, very strongly what, think about it. Think of how did the first Stateman movie start It, start with Hank Pam getting into an argument with Howard Stark. If he would've known that Scott would've gone and helped a stark, he wouldn't have given him anything. And I know he stole a suit, he did this, he did that, but we would've never gotten condominium. 'cause he would've just disowned him. And he would've been dead to Hank had he done that.
Speaker 2 00:16:22 So hear me out though, I think that if you look at his motivations as a father, he a hundred percent would've went along with it because what was Stark trying to do, stark was feeling guilty because people were dying. And that was reflective in that first scene where the mom, like there was the picture at him mm-hmm. <affirmative>. And so he could have appealed to Scott's like, we could protect your daughter from all of this trouble and all this heartache and from, from bad things happening to her. If we can just get a suit around the world and like protect people and like be regulated. And I think he would've went for it right away because his daughter was everything to him. And that would've been the emotional factor that would've triggered his psyche to just decide to side with, uh, Ironman.
Speaker 1 00:17:06 And I think too that, and I think in the, the WASP movie, I think, you know, the Pimms were angry at him. Um, you know, even very, even siding with for Kap. So I think, you know, the PIMS would've been angry at him no matter what. And he would've had to, um, you know, earn their respect Again. Either way I think, you know, you still could have that ant-man in the wasp plot point there,
Speaker 2 00:17:28 Right. 'cause they only actually take him back because they need him Yeah. To help them get something. They don't actually like him and they don't Yeah. Not until later on in the film. So like, you still could have that same point because they were just using him. I mean, as a means to an end.
Speaker 3 00:17:45 Those are good points. You guys, you guys definitely argue those very well. I, I still maintain though that there would be the whole thing, I'm not sure if this may have ever happened, but something tells me maybe off screen that Hank had a conversation with Scott about not trusting a stark.
Speaker 1 00:18:02 Oh, there was, there was definitely a moment. And I don't remember which movie it was in. I know that, that Hank definitely like, talked badly about Howard Star Atton and I just don't remember which movie it was in. And you know how awful he was to, and he would never team up with him. So I think there was actually a conversation where that happened. Um, like explicitly. So, yeah. Um, one thing I will also say about Civil War, I think it was a missed opportunity for, for Scott's ant power. 'cause I wanted to see more giant ants and, you know, see them in battle with the Avengers. That would've totally been fun. And I know Anthony was, you know, not alive anymore, but, you
Speaker 3 00:18:46 Know, that's, he said the homie
Speaker 1 00:18:48 <laugh>.
Speaker 3 00:18:49 Will you share the name? I I
Speaker 2 00:18:51 I do think though that prob part of that was probably that it was already such a cgi I heavy film <laugh>.
Speaker 3 00:18:56 Yeah.
Speaker 2 00:18:56 But I do agree that they didn't quite play up to the man part. And it was more of giant man, but nobody called him that. <laugh>. Uh, what, what does Rodie say? Uh, little man got big, like that's Yeah. The closest we got to it. So we should have seen more ants. I want, there should be tons of ants in this quantum mania film. Or we, we should riot <laugh>.
Speaker 3 00:19:19 I like the fact he missed the ants. 'cause I'm thinking now imagine if he would've, you know, increased the size of an ant, how Peter Parker would've freaked out. Mm-hmm. <affirmative>. So he would've, a Spider versus Ant would've been one of the funniest little insect jokes you could ever come up with. Yep.
Speaker 2 00:19:33 Missed opportunity.
Speaker 1 00:19:35 Yep.
Speaker 2 00:19:36 They should
Speaker 3 00:19:37 Have, they could try again later on in Secret Wars or King Dynasty or something.
Speaker 2 00:19:43 Absolutely.
Speaker 1 00:19:44 So after Civil Well is actually, is there anything else you guys wanna talk about with Civil War? I mean, that airport scene was kind of the, the biggest thing for,
Speaker 3 00:19:53 I mean, he set himself up for failure in, in going and doing that because, you know, as we lead into Qua into Aman in the Wasp, we know <laugh>, he's on house arrest because of what he did in Berlin. <laugh>. So this is a good segue.
Speaker 1 00:20:09 So the next Amman movie, um, Antman versus the Wasp, what are your, you know,
Speaker 3 00:20:15 Versus I thought it was, and, uh,
Speaker 1 00:20:17 Antman on the Wasp, I'm sorry.
Speaker 3 00:20:18 I mean, for a good, honestly, that movie kind of was Amen. Versus the was because she really shows them up every single time she gets the opportunity. And I loved it. It was great <laugh> because we, we knew like when Aman ended, we're like, why didn't she get a suit? And then we get the post credit scene with the suit and you're like, oh yeah, it's happened now mm-hmm. <affirmative> like, we're going into it. And then when it did happen, man, she really, she really, she put the hurt on Sonny Birch. That was great.
Speaker 1 00:20:43 Oh yeah. <laugh>
Speaker 3 00:20:44 Was one of our favorite actors. Yep. Ing Doggs,
Speaker 1 00:20:49 Who's gonna be in the new Fallout <laugh>.
Speaker 2 00:20:51 She definitely, she'd showed in the very, in very little of Amen, the was how she was a superior fighter to Scott in every way, because she made it look easy. And, and she, the whole scene in the diner is just one of the top scenes for me of the M C U as a whole. I love that scene.
Speaker 3 00:21:11 I was gonna say in the first hand, man, she really just kind of mm-hmm. <affirmative> made a point when she said, you know, how to punch, and then she just knocks him out real <laugh>. Oh yeah. Right. Then I'm like, oh man, why isn't she suiting up? Like, what's up with that?
Speaker 1 00:21:24 I do like how on the first Ant-Man movie, we kind of got an epic training, kind of like a montage where he is Oh yeah. Learning how to be small. I really enjoyed that. And it was fun that she was his trainer.
Speaker 3 00:21:35 That was excellent.
Speaker 2 00:21:37 I do appreciate that.
Speaker 1 00:21:39 So, you know, ant-Man in the Wasp, not versus the Wasp, um, you know, was, was had a lot of comedic moments mm-hmm. <affirmative>, and I'm gonna go back to the Ants because I don't know, they were awesome. And Jimmy Wu, because, you know, so Scott's on parole and he gets busted out to do, you know, to do this thing for Hank and Jen or Hank and, um, Hank and the Wasp and the ants take his place. And I just love those moments where like, the ants in the tub and the ants playing the drums. I just, they're
Speaker 3 00:22:12 The drums.
Speaker 1 00:22:12 Yeah. Perfect.
Speaker 2 00:22:14 I, I do think that one of the things that Amy and the Wasp did that was so genius was that now that we're like indoctrinated to the aunt family's life, they really played on that. And I appreciate that more because we got to see silly things like the aunt playing the drums, <laugh> and <laugh>, giant man against the building, pretending to hide. And like, you know, there's like, I don't know, it felt, it felt good. It felt like a natural progression for all of these characters and you got to see more of that world. Um, but I still feel like it's not enough. I want more of it. <laugh>.
Speaker 3 00:22:50 <laugh>. Another thing I really liked about the movie is that it showed just how ahead of the curve. Hank Ishmm. I mean, we know he's a genius and the comics, he's the person that comes up with the hold tron. But really it's like how he shrunk his lab and made it portable, like literally a carry on. I love that little bit mm-hmm. <affirmative>. And not just that, but how he kept the little, um, what is it, a film roll where he,
Speaker 1 00:23:12 The Hot Wheels case.
Speaker 3 00:23:13 Hot Wheels case things mm-hmm. <affirmative> and where he kept all the cars. Like just little things like that or just so, just so genius that it mm-hmm. <affirmative> makes sense with this character.
Speaker 2 00:23:23 You know, something you said there about, we didn't talk about for the first film, but Michael Douglas as Hank Pimm was probably the most unexpected casting for me. But it's probably one of the best. 'cause you know, when you think of Michael Douglas, you think of like mobster films or like action films and this showcase that like, not only is he getting older, but like he still has these like comedic chops to him. And like he could play an angry individual who's also this like, great scientist. And I just think that it's like almost, I don't see a lot of people talking about it. I feel like it should be talked about more because we got such a legendary actor into the M C U Yeah. For what could have been a small part. And he's fantastic in it.
Speaker 1 00:24:05 He owns that part. I think. And I, you know, I, I tried to go through in my head of other actors that could have been, um, Hank Pim and the only one who I could think maybe would come close but wouldn't have those comedic tops that you mentioned would be Martin Sheen. Um, yeah. Oh. And, uh, I don't think it would've been as, as iconic as,
Speaker 2 00:24:23 No.
Speaker 1 00:24:24 You know, as, as as this one.
Speaker 2 00:24:28 No. But Martin Sheen would've been, he would've been a more serious take. But, and I would've appreciated that. But no, there's not really anybody that could take Michael Douglas's place as Hank Pim. And I do hope that he continues past quantum mania. I guess that remains to be seen what happens. But I love him in that role.
Speaker 3 00:24:46 Yeah. So I guess we could kind of make a mention of how we spent a little bit more time in the quantum realm, like in that first movie. Mm-hmm. <affirmative>, it was very brief. Mm-hmm. <affirmative>, he, he, he only did it because he was trying to save, um, his daughter's life. Yep. And then in the second one, he actually, they delve into it. They actually sent Hank in there instead with a little bit of a vehicle to kind of navigate his way around and, and mm-hmm. <affirmative> and look for Janet. Um, I thought it was interesting how there was a connection through the Quantum, I don't, I don't know a word for it. Um,
Speaker 1 00:25:23 Entanglement machine.
Speaker 3 00:25:24 Sure. Entanglement iss. Great. <laugh> that works. But it's kind of like interesting how she was able to use that to put her impression using Scott as a vessel and then taking over his body. You know, being able to speak, being able to, to work alongside Hank to help them get there, to find her and all that.
Speaker 1 00:25:46 The acting that Paul Rudd did in the scene where, you know, he is Janet, is just incredible and it shows his range and you know, how, how great of an actor he is. And I, I don't think he gets credit for that, um, often enough. So that was just fantastic.
Speaker 3 00:26:04 Yeah.
Speaker 2 00:26:04 Oh, absolutely. That scene is also a standout just because he pollard's fantastic in whatever he acts in mm-hmm. <affirmative>. But that scene is in particular is really something else. Um, but you know, yes, we did get to dive into the quantum realm quite a bit more, which was really cool because it felt like it, that it was expanding a different part of the world, the universe that we'd never seen before. Um, because we've seen space, you know, we've seen the, the regular Marvel cinematic universe, but this one dives down into what is in miniature. Um, and they actually came up, you know, with Quantum Realm. They had to come up with that name because it's not called that in the comics, but they can't have it for copyright issues. Um, what
Speaker 1 00:26:46 Is it? Is it called Micro verse or Yeah.
Speaker 2 00:26:48 Called the Micro Verse. And that actually resides with the micro knots, I believe so. Um, so it's really cool that you, you know, you got to dive into this world. You, and it all was kind of reminiscent of some of the worlds that we saw in Dr. Strange when he's going through his mind trip. And so it kind of showed that like, okay, maybe this is connected through some other form of exploration. Maybe it's all connected through different universes. Um, and so I think that it was really cool to dive down into that. But this film also gave us something really cool too, because if we're talking about villains, which we didn't talk about Darren Chris. Mm-hmm. Darren Chris was just kind of like a megalomaniac. He was kind of crazy <laugh>. Um, he wanted the power he was getting. He was, he was feeding off the power. But Ghost is fantastic <laugh> because this is some, this was someone who was just trying to like, find a way to survive. 'cause they were in pain all the time. Yep. I think that is something that a lot of individuals can relate to of just like, we're not thriving, but we're just trying to survive because life has been really hard for us. Um, and her powers are really cool too, and at least in some really cool fight scenes. Um, and so I think that in that way it was an improvement over Ant Man.
Speaker 1 00:27:57 Yeah. You really feel for her as a villain. If, if you can feel for, for a villain, I guess. Um, you know, she lost her parents when she was very young and she was taken by Shields and, you know, again, shield not always the good guys. And they, they trained her to be this, this killing machine, um, all while she was suffering and hurting and, you know, they didn't necessarily help her. Um, and I, I wanna talk about Bill Foster too, 'cause I think he's an interesting character, but, you know, Anthony, I'm curious what you think about Ghost.
Speaker 3 00:28:31 Actually, I, I was gonna go back to, to Darren Cross, um, because it just kind of clicked to me while, while you were describing him, Brian, but you know who he reminds me of just a little bit, not a whole lot mm-hmm. <affirmative>, but he reminds me of the Green Goblin in the original Spider-Man series. Yes. If you think about it, he has chemicals that make him balance. He's got a suit that he is got that he's still working to get this formula Right. And then he's just trying to keep his board in line and he takes out people that are along the way stopping him from reaching his goal, which is exactly what Green Goland did in the first movie. But, um, as far as Absolutely, yeah, I know that's going back, but it was just like a thought that came to me. I'm like, man, almost parallel to, to Norman Osborne's arc in that first movie.
Speaker 3 00:29:16 And, and, and his arrogance kind of worked against him and made him lose to the, to the superhero. But as far as Ghost, I'll be honest, she was one that left me probably one of the lesser impressions out of all the, the, uh, villains in the M C U. But at the same time, it was nice that it was a little bit of a switch up because it wasn't just someone that was like a parallel to the main hero. Like, you know, yellow Jacket was, he's another guy with a suit that can make himself small and do this, but he's got different, he's got a little bit modification. This one's actually quite tragic, like you've already said. Sure. She lost her parents, but then because of her, 'cause she was trying to sacrifice herself to save her dad, she got hit with these waves. It changed her entire structure of her life and ruined her life.
Speaker 3 00:30:03 Mm-hmm. <affirmative> and, and and of no consequence of her own, she was trying to do the right thing. And then as you said, now she's involved with Bill Foster and he tried his best to keep her life moving forward throughout it all. And even though he made the effort, she still has that vindictive, like, no, I'm gonna get mine. And, and it impressed me with Bill Foster, even with his absolute and obvious, because he said it out loud, hatred for Hank Pimm, when he noticed that ghost was starting to go off the rail. He said, I'm not gonna be a part of this. Mm-hmm. <affirmative> that impressed me. And not just that, but you know, again, Lawrence for that one was just awesome, great actor, great kid. And, and, and the little banter between him and, and, uh, Scott when they're like, you know, what's the biggest you got? And that gave him a moment for was to say, okay, let's stop comparing sizes here, which is a nice little comedic moment. Um, I only wish that there would've been another flashback, like there was in the first movie, which I know there was a flashback with Ghost, but with him showing what he did when he increased the size and everything, that, that's the only thing I felt was minor missed. But with what was going on with the movie, it would've kind of wasted time. So I understand that
Speaker 1 00:31:18 Maybe we still will see him. Right. Bill Foster is not, you know, he is, he's helping Ghost, he's helping Hank Pim. Yep. Um, he still has his professor job. I liked that he didn't turn in Hank. I thought that was kind of an interesting, um, an interesting thing there. And I also, you know, I agree with you that Lawrence Fishburn is amazing. And from what I understand, like he's a massive comic book fan. He's just like, yes, super. Yes he is. Yeah. He's superly into
Speaker 3 00:31:45 It. He's a big Marvel guy.
Speaker 1 00:31:46 Yeah. And he, he actually is part of the reason that Moon Girl and Devil Dinosaur is getting a series at all. Um, so he was like, he's in that and he's also like a super strong, um, proponent of that, that book or that, that comic book series and then the, the animated series. So he's all in. Wow.
Speaker 2 00:32:05 You know, I do have to say with Lawrence Fishburne as I do feel like he was wasted a little bit in this film just because he has such a small part. And I'm like, come on, this is like such a, like a prolific actor. And I did, knowing who Bill Foster was, I wanted to see him as Goliath. And I was hoping that like there was gonna be like an end credit sting of him suiting up or something, or like some flashback. And, and I felt like that was the one of the only missteps, um, of Amen. And the wasp. And you know, this is not exactly Uday level, but I saw that movie six times in theaters because I loved it so much. And that's the one thing I always walk away with, is I wanted more of Bill Foster because he just seemed very one dimensional. And Lawrence Fishburne, I mean, gave us the Matrix, one of the greatest trilogies of our generation. He
Speaker 3 00:32:54 Also gave us one of my favorite memes, the one from the Manas Steel. Another news water is Wet
Speaker 1 00:33:02 <laugh>
Speaker 3 00:33:03 For, for those following, it's the Perry White when in Manas Steel when they were talking about Gotham having crime. But, um, one thing we haven't mentioned, and I just want to kind of talk about a little bit we did earlier, but like talk about it more, is Walton Goggin's, Sonny Birch. Mm-hmm. Because he is a black market dealer who works for the benefactor, that we still have not gotten a name or any sort of like, connection to. Um, I believe our own, Alex Perez has mentioned somewhere along the way that the benefactor might come, come into play this time around. I really wanna see that followed through. But what interests me is there's this technology floating around in markets in Hawkeye. We saw some of this stuff on sale mm-hmm. In an auction. Mm-hmm. Like where are these coming from? Thi this could play into a larger thing, into where like, we've got all this stuff that is very dangerous because it is so reality altering. And you're telling me that if you know a guy, you can just buy it.
Speaker 1 00:34:02 <laugh>. There are a lot of shady defense contractors and um, you know, rich people that seem to want to, you know, just have fun with their money, it seems like in the, the Marvel universe. And I think the point about Hawkeye in that, um, that Avengers Tower auction is such a great one to make because like, that's stuff that can really mess that society up. You know, what, what was it? There was a thing from the Savage Land and there was there a ring or something? There was a, a Ronan suit. So yeah.
Speaker 2 00:34:33 And the watch,
Speaker 1 00:34:34 Yeah. The wa the watch. Of course the watch. I think, um, I totally hope we find out about the benefactor soon. And I think there have been a couple of gli glimpses of who it maybe could be. Um, in some of these TV series, you know,
Speaker 2 00:34:48 You, you talk, you talk about these black market deals, but I was at GameStop early today and they had Kamal K's Bengals on sale for $149. So it's like <laugh>, I could just go to GameStop and get 'em
Speaker 3 00:35:00 While you're there. Gimme the 10 rings from Chong Chi. I really want those.
Speaker 1 00:35:04 I just want the moon night thing.
Speaker 3 00:35:06 Want the crossing darts. Yeah.
Speaker 2 00:35:08 Ones that are so awesome. Mm-hmm. <affirmative>. But truly the, I think that, uh, Walton Goggins is coming back because mm-hmm. <affirmative>, you don't introduce something like the benefactor in this character, specifically working for the benefactor and don't have something come from this. And I think, I don't, you know, this is not me confirming anything people, I have no sources, but I think we're gonna see it probably in Daredevil. I think this, this is where a lot of it's gonna come to play because organized crime has been, uh, a very street level thing. And Anthony, as you remember, we wrote a whole article about what's coming up with the street level things and Daredevil's one of the biggest names, and I can't see it not play somewhere into this, Anthony's thinking he's, he's <laugh>, he's got this look on his face. Well,
Speaker 3 00:35:51 Well, well, like I've been working on this, this pretty big theory article on Daredevil and you're like, making me think should I include this or not? So that, but that's a thought for another evening. But
Speaker 2 00:36:02 <laugh> for after the podcast.
Speaker 3 00:36:04 After the podcast,
Speaker 1 00:36:05 Yeah. Stay tuned. No, um, yeah, my mind is kind of blown with that as well and thinking about that and you know, the benefactor and Daredevil. 'cause I dunno, I, I would think it'd be in something more mutant oriented, just, and again, this is not me confirming anything either. This is just me, you know, thinking about, well you have this giant nation full of like gnarly things and where law doesn't mm-hmm. <affirmative> seem to matter. So
Speaker 3 00:36:33 Look at Cap or Falcon in the Winter Soldier, we had Magic Poor where all these people are running around with all these things going. So I'm surprised we didn't get a link there. Now that I think about it, I'm actually quite, quite surprised
Speaker 2 00:36:49 It's all coming. Yeah,
Speaker 3 00:36:51 Of course it will happen. Eventually everything will fall in line just like the Scorpion cameo in far from home. Right, right. Or, um, home Cut
Speaker 2 00:36:59 And five Baby,
Speaker 3 00:37:01 Those who know me know that it's a running thing that I always complain about.
Speaker 1 00:37:06 I think it's, but uh, fair though, because you know, there, you know, one thing with Marvel, there are all these moving pieces and all these little things that, you know, eventually come together to form, you know, the next movie, the Next Property. And with Ant-Man, I just wonder how they're going to do it given that there seem, there is, I mean obviously such a quantum focus, like how do you have like we, our, our scenes for this movie that we've seen in the trailer, you know, are in the quantum quantum realm besides a couple where like Cassie's getting arrested where Aunt Man's a celebrity. Most of the stuff we see happens in the quantum realm. How do we, like it's a new territory <laugh> kind of.
Speaker 2 00:37:46 I think that part of it though is that we're not gonna get as much of the real world. 'cause Yeah. If I, if I remember correctly, like, uh, Luis is not in this film. He's been cut. That's
Speaker 1 00:37:58 Awful. That's the worst.
Speaker 2 00:37:59 So the real world's gonna kind of get set aside for this quantum exploration. So I don't think we're gonna get any of this. I don't think there's gonna be any kind of, I wouldn't be surprised if we don't even get any mention of Ghost, like maybe a passing line. But like the real world's gonna get really set aside for what happens, um, in the quantum realm. And that's what the focus is gonna be.
Speaker 3 00:38:20 Yeah. And, and in regards to that, um, I was thinking now that we've gone past the first two movies, what's our next thing is that we got an introduction. We got a soft introduction to our villain. And Loki at the end there with he who remains, he starts off with a pretty good semi monologue and he says he's been called lots of things throughout time. A ruler, a Conqueror, and right there, you know, the collective group of Marble Francisco. Oh, it's there, it's coming. Which we knew he was already cast as king going into Quantum Mania, but it was getting Jonathan Majors right from the get go.
Speaker 1 00:38:59 Mm-hmm. <affirmative>.
Speaker 3 00:39:00 Mm-hmm. <affirmative> amazing choice for King. Um, they put out another little clip today. Mm-hmm. <affirmative> like 30 seconds long. Man, I'm terrified and excited to see this man on this screen. Mm-hmm.
Speaker 1 00:39:13 <affirmative>.
Speaker 2 00:39:15 No, he's fantastic. He was probably one of the best choices. Um, and I didn't actually know his name before they announced him for as King or for Quantum Mania. And then the moment I saw him in Loki, I was like, oh man, this guy is on a different level. Yeah. And he is fantastic in these films. He has a worth eth ethic like none other. He also puts out like he has like four or five movies that came out this past year. Like this man does not stop. Yep.
Speaker 3 00:39:44 He's busy.
Speaker 2 00:39:45 And every film is just like high quality. And so just from the clips of that we see here, I think that King is, I'm so ready to see him in every other film that's coming up in phase five and six. 'cause he's not going anywhere. Right. <laugh>.
Speaker 1 00:39:58 Yeah. And I, I wanna back us up really briefly because, you know, even even before Loki, even before Kang, you know, we still have endgame with, with Antman and Sure. Antman is very important in, um, in Endgame and in some ways that leads into, you know, time travel leads into Loki and leads into to Kang and all of that. So, you know, what, what do you guys think about, um, Antman and Endgame and
Speaker 3 00:40:27 Scott? Well, we could, I like partially put the blame on him for, for Loki getting loose. So if anything, it's his own fault that he has to face King <laugh>. You have to, it's not even that much of a leap in logic, but he's the one that brought forth the idea of going through time and then he went back, he messed up on flicking the, the suitcase with the Tester Act and ended up at Loki's feet. Boom. Full circle. It's his own damn fault. <laugh>.
Speaker 2 00:40:49 Oh my gosh. If we you explain it that way. Yeah. You're, I will say that, um, I liked the emotional journey that he had in end game because he came into this, he was kind of our, our first entry into the coming back five years later mm-hmm. <affirmative> and everything's changed. And we got that later with some of the, the characters who had been, you know, snapped. But he came back to a fully grown daughter in a world that was in the scenes that we've seen. The world was like, looks like it was like post apocalyptic in some ways. Yep. And for him it was only, what, 30 minutes, but five minutes,
Speaker 3 00:41:26 Minutes. It
Speaker 1 00:41:26 Was something very short. Yeah. Yeah.
Speaker 3 00:41:28 That's what he said. He came, five minutes went by five years for him.
Speaker 2 00:41:31 Okay. And the world changed and he didn't know what to do with that. So I feel like I loved how he transitioned from, he wasn't, he was still funny, but there was like a real seriousness to him because his life had changed so drastically and so quickly that he was just trying to catch up and that you really got to see like a more of like a hero stature than just like the funny hero that he was in the first two films.
Speaker 3 00:41:56 Yeah. And, and another thing, uh, I really liked about his character in Endgame is that they played to his strains. What's he really good at Heist? What'd they do? Mm-hmm. <affirmative> A Heist,
Speaker 1 00:42:03 A Time Heist,
Speaker 3 00:42:05 A Time Heist, <laugh>.
Speaker 1 00:42:08 Um, absolutely. So, you know, the next movie, Antman Quantum Mania, and I'll say before that, I know there's some plot stuff going around, like none of us have watched that. This is all just us talking based on what we've seen in the trailers and what we, um, you know, what we think based on the previous movies. So what, what are your expectations for the newest Ant-Man movie? What, um, what do you really want to see happen?
Speaker 2 00:42:37 You know, something that Anthony had pointed out very early on in this podcast was this film is kicking off phase five mm-hmm. <affirmative> and like, what a way to kick off phase five. Just from what we've seen in the trailers. This movie is about to be humongous. It's gonna be huge. And I am so excited to see how this plays out. 'cause like from the trailers, it looks like King is offering Scott Beck time, the time that he lost, which we saw from Endgame, you know, this is mm-hmm. <affirmative>, this has been building now for a little bit. And he feels like he's missed out on all this time and probably thinking like after, you know, the time ice and stuff like that, he doesn't have to worry about like, messing up his timeline 'cause it's just gonna bring Branch off into another one. And so there's like not a lot of stakes. There's like not a lot of to, to him he could just gain all this stuff back. And so I'm really interested to see again, where this personal journey goes. But I mean, I'm so excited to see the fight between him and King that we kind of got a glimpse of today. And that that trailer, when he's yelling King's name and King is blowing that blue lightning energy at him. Mm-hmm. <affirmative>, I think we're in for some, one of the biggest films we've seen probably since the start of phase four.
Speaker 1 00:43:53 It seems like he, in the end of that particular fight, like he's almost ready to sacrifice himself. And I think that's, you know, interesting and kind of totally in line with his character too because, you know, again, he is, he is doing the right thing. He's doing it for Cassie, he, you know, he mm-hmm. <affirmative>, um, you know, he, he's a hero even without powers. He just has that, that mindset. Um, and I think that, so I'm, I'm totally losing my train of thought, but, um, I think that, yeah, I totally lost my train of thought. Nevermind.
Speaker 3 00:44:27 It's okay. I've got an idea just because something I can go with on that little spot that came out today. There's a moment where Janet says, and I don't know to who I'm assuming Scott, is that King can shatter mm-hmm. <affirmative>, um, what, what is it? Reality
Speaker 1 00:44:41 Timelines, right?
Speaker 3 00:44:43 Mm-hmm. Um, I'm watching it, right? <laugh>, I'm open on my second screen, he can shatter existence. Oh.
Speaker 3 00:44:49 So what that could mean is, is just kind of, well I can't wait to watch the movie and find out exactly what that can mean, but that puts him in a unique position that he's got more power than we really think about. And I mean, this is guy that's just, just a genius, nothing more. Mm-hmm. Like, like you said, he doesn't have superpowers. So to be able to kinda rewrite reality, that's a Wanda level sort of thing to be able to do. Right. But without any of the powers that Infinity Stones, no, no power ups. I just all from, from capability of the mind. Mm-hmm. Um, what interests me is that she's already familiar with him. She wouldn't say this kind of like, oh, oh hey, you know, like there must've been some exposure for Janet while she was down there to this guy knowing, Hey, I've seen what he can do. You should be terrified. So mm-hmm. <affirmative>. So for her to come to Scott or Hank or whoever to say these things just kind of really drives forth how like, tough this guy's gonna be. Not just for Scott, but for the Avengers for everyone. Sure.
Speaker 1 00:45:57 Well I think, you know, it almost seems as if he's trapped in there in the quantum realm. And you know, that leads to the question, well, who trapped him? And I wonder if it, it maybe could have been Janet or she could have been involved with, with that somehow because she knew his power. Um, and she knew what he was capable of. And the thing I've completely forgot that I was, you know, talking about earlier was, you know, Kang has all of his power, but he still needs something from Mattman. He still needs something from Scott from the trailers. So I'm curious to see what that is. And you know, again, it has every other Ant-Man movie, you know, someone has needed something from him as well that kind of kicks off all that stuff. So I'm curious to see it like how that happens here.
Speaker 3 00:46:37 That's an interesting mention just because you're making me think back to Loki where they talk about the multiverse war. He who remains is the one that ends up on top. I wouldn't be surprised if it was he who remains stuck him in there, or, or this is another prevailing theory is that he escaped to the quantum realm. He got himself stuck in there trying to avoid being part of the multiverse war and then getting taken out. So he's a remnant left behind. And you know, dear listeners, yeah, this is not confirmation, but just the theorizing, it wouldn't surprise me if there's more variants floating around that found other universes or just other methods to escape. Just because we got from the TVA that little bit saying, oh yeah, the multiverse war ended, we got the timekeepers. Remember that was purely propaganda. That was, that was doctored and made by King himself to put in front of the tva A so he could sell that and have his workers remain in line. Mm-hmm.
Speaker 2 00:47:32 <affirmative>. Sure. You know, I think that all this talk about quantum mania and, and the villain of the story, we're also forgetting another villain, which is the worst kept seeker by Marvel <laugh>. Which is, which is Modoc in, you know, in the trailer, what was it, the second trailer, whatever. Yeah. One of the more recent trailers. Okay. We saw Darren, we saw Darren in return as Modoc, you know, last time we saw him was the end of Antman and he was getting kind of transfigured by <laugh>, um, by the distance. You remember I sent
Speaker 3 00:48:06 You that video months ago. I was thinking about like, dude, look, if you notice in the very end of the clip, his head is the last thing to shrink. Mm-hmm. <affirmative> the body goes first, but then the head is the last one to shrink. Yep. Can you watch it in slow motion?
Speaker 2 00:48:17 And now he's coming back as Modoc And Modoc is this character that like, isn't usually played by, um, this character in the M C U, but it is definitely an interesting change. And, um, I don't know how I feel about it. I I'm have to wait to see how it's gonna be when we, when it shows up on my screen. Um, 'cause the trailer one made me a little bit iffy. It kinda look like George Lopez from Shark Boy and Lava Girl. Exactly. But what do, what do you guys thinking? Modoc?
Speaker 1 00:48:47 So I, you know, I I'm not super excited for this character. Um, you know, I had he read about the casting stuff beforehand and who, you know, who was going to, I guess voice him. Um, you know, I guess Bill Murray is gonna voice him from, from, you know, deadline and all of those sources. Um, I just am not thrilled about, thrilled not about the character. I just want Kang not, not Modoc.
Speaker 3 00:49:14 I'm curious how, what his part plays into it. 'cause from my understanding is he's like a, a lieutenant in King's Army or something. Like he reports to him. So it, I'm assuming after the events of the first Aman movie he got found rescued. 'cause we know King's a genius and an engineer say probably like, Hey, your body's all screwed up. I can give you something to kind of keep you from being be completely destabilized. Um, but honestly, Modoc to me is kind of like the lesser I'm with you. I'm with you Isla. I'm not that excited about it. Like, it's cool, but eh,
Speaker 1 00:49:53 I wonder if he, so in the trailers it makes like seem or makes, they make it seem like, um, that Kenang knows about Scott. That he's ant ant-man, he's an Avenger. You know, he's fought the Avengers before he knows about these superheroes. Do you think Modoc maybe told him all about Scott? Because Modoc would obviously have, you know, a, a grudge with Scott and something, a bone to pick with him based on their,
Speaker 2 00:50:18 It it definitely seems like that King knows from previous fighting, which was probably the multiverse war. Um, this definitely did not seem close to Modoc. But I do think it's interesting because with Mok playing like second fiddle villain in this film, to me that sounds expendable. 'cause we know we're not getting rid of King. We have King Dy Dynasty coming up mm-hmm. <affirmative>. And I think that it could potentially be a waste of a character who, like Modoc is a huge villain. He could be in multiple films and maybe there's gonna be a second Modoc, a Modoc 2.0 or something. But it just seems really weird to have two major villains in such a pivotal movie, and I don't expect the ca, I don't expect that, uh, Modoc is gonna make it out of this one.
Speaker 3 00:51:02 I agree with everything Brian said. So there you go.
Speaker 2 00:51:07 There you have it <laugh>.
Speaker 3 00:51:09 There it is.
Speaker 1 00:51:11 Now, I will say about this movie that, um, I'm disappointed to hear that Luis isn't in it because he was such a highlight, you know, in the other movies and that just kind of, you know, goes hand in hand with, with Ant Man. So I'm very sad to hear that. It's a bummer.
Speaker 2 00:51:28 It's definitely disappointing. Uh, but I think that there's still room for him in our world. I'm still waiting for them to release that video of him recounting everything up to, uh, endgame <laugh> because I think we all need that. Yes. Um, I just think that this film kind of like Thor Ragner Rock is taking this of hero story in such a different direction and unfortunately the real world doesn't fit into that. But there is a world where Luis is still there, <laugh>, and we're gonna get more of him.
Speaker 3 00:52:00 I, I have a random thing to interject, but this is only because I'm here with you Isla, right now. Okay. Have you seen that little spot I was talking about earlier today? It's like 30 seconds long.
Speaker 1 00:52:09 No, I haven't Is this the Modoc or the, the Darren Cross thing?
Speaker 3 00:52:12 No, no, no, no, no. Um, there's a scene where, where Scott goes big and he yells gang.
Speaker 1 00:52:19 Oh yes, I I saw that. Yeah. Okay, Han you're thinking Han
Speaker 3 00:52:23 Exactly, which I get. Exactly. I was like, my, my dear Star Trek friend, I'm like, I'm surprised you haven't mentioned that. It's like, it's clearly a callback to a classic, you know? Absolutely. I love when they do those little renditions and kind of give a little bit of, um, a respect to those things. And I was, I was thinking of you when I saw that. I just want you to know that
Speaker 1 00:52:40 <laugh> <laugh>, and so many of you know, I, I know they didn't write this movie, but so many of the Marvel TV writers, um, you know, write for Star Trek now. So, you know, there's a lot of love in the, the Geekdom for, for that. Um, one thing we haven't super talked about is Cassie. And Cassie seems to be a real driving force for this movie, um, in the trailer. You know, we see her, I guess, getting, um, bailed out of jail and that seems like that would be something that would affect Scott very greatly given that he was in jail, um, to see his, you know, his daughter who he had all missed all this time with, you know, go down a path that maybe isn't so great. And I'm curious to see what you think is going on there.
Speaker 3 00:53:22 I do have a good thought on that one actually. I'm glad you asked that because remember back to the first movie, she would say like, oh, I want to be your partner. And she looks up to her dad and she knows what her dad did. Mm-hmm. She's not like, I mean, even though she's a little kid, she's not stupid. I mean, she's quite, she, she picks up a lot. My best guess is that she tried to do the right thing ala Scott Lang in the Antman mm-hmm. <affirmative> and got herself in trouble. And I think because of that, once they get through into the quantum realm and then Kang is offering Scott the opportunity to kind of undo things, Scott feels motivated by that because as proud as he may be of his daughter, he doesn't want to see her start to go down that line. I mean, at that age, I'm sure she's probably trying to get into college and things and mm-hmm. <affirmative> and the rest can kind of really put a damper on those plans if they notice like, Hey, you know, as a juvenile you were doing these sort of things. Um, the only thing I'm, I'm curious about is she wears a suit in some scenes mm-hmm. <affirmative>,
Speaker 3 00:54:25 But not before they go into the quantum realm. There's like that scene where they're standing around a little beacon that she mm-hmm. <affirmative> created, which, which is awesome. <laugh>, she's, she's intelligent like her dad as well, it seems. But then later on in the scene there's like that, you know, kind of zoom out where it shows her wasp and ant-man all suited up together up against. So I'm wondering what that's about. Uh, clearly Cassie is the driving force behind it all. I mean, he kind of only started doing what he did because he was trying to get the money for child support so he could spend time with his daughter to begin with. Yeah. So
Speaker 2 00:55:03 I definitely agree that I had the same thought of when she's getting sucked into the quantum room, it's like she doesn't have a suit on her. How is she gonna get the suit in the quantum room that we see later? Um, and I think part of that's going to come from Bill Murray and Janet and whatever's going on with the two of them, because I think they're gonna find him being an ally and there's gonna be an extra suit or unless they have happen to have packed a spare one for some reason, I don't know. But, um, I think it's a very good question mark about that maybe will be a plot hole, but we'll have to see.
Speaker 3 00:55:36 I wouldn't put, put it past Kang to offer her that too. Sure. Using that a way to butter up Scott to be like, Hey, I want you to go do this task, whatever, to get me outta the quantum realm and saying, here, I'll even outfit your daughter so she can help you and you can move forward. For all we know, they got sucked in at different seconds. Uh, like there with the quantum realm, I, I've got a good feeling they're all not gonna land just right next to each other. I mean, let's think back to Wizard of Oz. Mm-hmm. <affirmative>, like the house landed over here and Dorothy over there. Like, it's gonna have some sort of similarity. I I can imagine
Speaker 1 00:56:09 They're gonna have to find each other and you know, they're gonna have to go through some stuff to find each other. Um,
Speaker 2 00:56:16 Absolutely.
Speaker 1 00:56:17 And, you know, I think that'll be, maybe that'll be how they encounter how Scott encounters Kang initially. Um, I don't know. So we're, we're getting pretty close to an hour. Um, is there anything, and we've had such a great discussion, is there anything you guys wanna talk about, about the upcoming movie, you know, before we go see it the next time we chat? We'll have seen it in theaters. Anything you wanna get off your off your chest?
Speaker 2 00:56:44 You know, I definitely think that, while it's always fun talking to you, I'm excited to see what happens in the next one because we'll be having a special guest, um, Alex Perez is gonna be joining us for the Quantum Mania Review slash look forward of what comes next. And we all know that Mr. Perez has the, has the good information and has the good theories. I mean, we have good theories too. That's, that's not to say that we're not good, but I think it's gonna be really cool to see what the three of you come up with on that next episode.
Speaker 1 00:57:16 He knows things. Um, it's gonna be very, very exciting chatting with him.
Speaker 2 00:57:22 And all I have to say is that if you haven't checked out his Twitter, there's already some hints about what's gonna happen in this film and you're missing out <laugh>. So follow, so follow him on Twitter people,
Speaker 1 00:57:32 Alex from cc
Speaker 3 00:57:34 It's definitely gonna elevate, um, the things that Cassie has done and will do in the future. I'll say that. Um, the only one thing I wanna passively quickly speak about is, is I'm just curious why you think, why y'all think that, um, Scott would even take up King's offer. I know we kind of talked about it, but it's like you would think with the warnings from Janet and kinda like the wishy washiness of it, why would he take it up?
Speaker 2 00:58:04 I think it all boils down to him being a father and mm-hmm. <affirmative>, you, you would sacrifice mostly anything for your kids. I mean, I don't have kids, but I have a dog and I would absolutely do anything for my fucking dog. Um, but I think that when you have a child or something you care about, you're willing to make some really stupid decisions. Mm-hmm. <affirmative>. And for him, there's not a lot of consequences. Like he doesn't think there's consequences. He thinks that it's all gonna work out. But what I think would be interesting is that if we get a glimpse of it or we like, maybe like, like a, like a image of what's gonna happen, it's gonna be reminiscent of what happened in Wa Vission where it's all gonna be your fake, you know, because this is, it's not his kid, it's not his life. I think that's what's gonna step him out. But I think you do anything for your kid, and I think that's what's gonna boil it down to
Speaker 3 00:58:52 Mine is, um, pretty simple. Everything Scott has ever done is he's always been a risk taker in the first Antman movie in the second Antman movie in Civil War and in Avengers, he is always saying he's always the one to take the risk because he knows that the payoff might be greater than the punishment.
Speaker 2 00:59:10 Ah,
Speaker 1 00:59:11 That's, that's a good line. That's, that's good. Um, you know, similar to Brian, I do think, you know, I think it's gonna be motivated by Cassie. I think he takes the risks because because of her, um, you know, she just kind of drives his, his existence at this point in life. So, you know, I think it'll all be connected to her.
Speaker 2 00:59:32 Absolutely.
Speaker 3 00:59:33 All right. And so when are you guys gonna watch the movie? I'm going on the 16th. I,
Speaker 2 00:59:37 Same here, three o'clock.
Speaker 1 00:59:39 I'm going on Friday. I don't know what date that is.
Speaker 3 00:59:42 That'd be the 17th. 17th,
Speaker 1 00:59:43 Yeah. I'm, I'm, I'm going on the 17th then. So I'm, I'll be behind you guys and I'll be trying to avoid spoilers like with the Spider-Man movie.
Speaker 2 00:59:53 You can do it. I believe in you <laugh>.
Speaker 3 00:59:55 How could you avoid spoilers for that movie Is Beyond Me. <laugh>.
Speaker 1 00:59:59 Yeah. Ugh,
Speaker 2 01:00:01 <laugh>.
Speaker 1 01:00:01 Well, thank you both for being here. Uh, where can, where can anybody find you? What's your, you know, your social media handles?
Speaker 2 01:00:11 I am Brian Kitson and you can find me at, uh, at Kitson 3 0 1 on Twitter.
Speaker 3 01:00:16 I'm Anthony Flagg. You can find me at at ruo.
Speaker 1 01:00:21 And I'm, uh, ala Ruby. And you can find me at tulin, t u l a n writes, and you can find all of us here for the Cosmic Circle at our very own new, uh, new Twitter handle. We have cosmic podcasts because, you know, we're gonna keep doing this. So Lizzie wanted me to make a special announcement that we have our own Twitter handle and that we're, you know, gonna keep doing it. So I'm excited.
Speaker 3 01:00:44 And don't forget to visit the cosmic circus.com.
Speaker 1 01:00:46 Yes, exactly. Uh, the cosmic circus.com. And this has been fun. So bye-bye.
Speaker 3 01:00:51 And man, his theaters on February 17th, catch it and then come back and <laugh>, listen to our follow up podcast.
Speaker 1 01:00:59 Exactly.
