Speaker 0 00:00:00 <silence>
Speaker 1 00:00:17 Hi everyone, and welcome to the Cosmic Circle, the official podcast for the cosmic circus.com, where we discuss everything nerdy under the cosmos. My name is Vin and I'm so excited to be joined by my super pals, Victor. And hello,
Speaker 2 00:00:30 Welcome. How are you? Howdy, howdy.
Speaker 1 00:00:33 Today we have an action packed episode about Superman. Uh, so guys, to start off today, I thought we would talk about our personal histories with the Man of Steel. Uh, when we first got to know him, uh, did we love him right away? Did we get it? Um, what were our thoughts? Our evolutions through Henry Cabell, through the animated series, Christopher Reeve Radio, everything. Um, who wants to go first?
Speaker 2 00:01:02 I'll go first 'cause mine is pretty short. Um, yeah, I'm actually trying to pull it up now, but my first memory of Superman is Six Flags Over Texas, if you remember that. Yeah. Yeah. There used to be, there used to be a bunch of rides and I just remember a Superman ride, but most of my time with Superman has been animated, which is great because later on we're gonna touch upon that a little bit more. And then the first live action one I saw was Superman returns with Brandon Ruth and Kevin Spacey. I enjoyed it for what it was at the time. Um, I understand that it's not beloved or favored by the Superman community. And then I saw Batman versus Superman in theaters when it came out and walked out of there regretting spending money. So,
Speaker 1 00:01:45 Oh my God. Did you see Man of Steel?
Speaker 2 00:01:48 Not till later. What? Hey man, everything from 2013 to 2016, we don't talk about. That was a weird time in my life.
Speaker 1 00:01:56 Alright, man. Did you ever watch the animated series? Did uh, did you catch up up on Christopher Reve later?
Speaker 2 00:02:03 Uh, never. I still haven't seen the Reve movies. Okay. Um, I've seen the animated series on and off. Like I watched all of them 'cause they were that, you know, Saturday morning cartoon block. I also watched the Justice League that he, you know, he was obviously in, uh, justice League Unlimited, I believe. Mm-hmm. <affirmative>. So majority of my experience with Superman has been animated movies. Okay. And the TV shows. And so really, I've only seen two Superman, caval, and Ruth and I haven't watched any other that I can think of. Not live action. That is, yeah.
Speaker 1 00:02:32 And did you, did you love Superman right away?
Speaker 2 00:02:36 I don't think I felt an immediate love, but I definitely enjoyed him for what he was. Um, it was just, I like the gentle giant sort of aesthetic with him. Like, he's, he's this big guy who shrinks himself a and it's so interesting to me because talking to Brian one time, he was telling me he is like, red, I've seen your photos. Like, you shrink yourself, you make yourself smaller. And I'm like, Hey, I'm super manning it. If I take off my glasses or put 'em on whatever, it'd be similar. So it was kind of relatable. I'm like, he, he's this guy who's tall and bulky. I'm, I'm just tall. I'm not bulky. I'm very skinny, tall <laugh>. But it's kind of weird how he does the same thing about hunching over and just kind of painting himself into the corner just 'cause he is trying to do his thing and not be bothered
Speaker 1 00:03:22 There. There's an exact moment you will know the moment and, and Christopher Reeve, 1978, there's one moment you'll freak out. It's exactly what you're talking about. And it, to this date, I think it's the best. Yeah. This one.
Speaker 2 00:03:33 Oh, I, I've seen the clip. No, it's a beautiful transformation. And that's the thing. But it always kind of gets me that he has the thing where the head's pointed down, like, his eyes never meet eye lines. He is bumbling, he shuffles. And it's a guy that can pick up tons and tons of steel and he can fly around the world and he is beloved, but he's like, no, I'm just keeping it to myself.
Speaker 1 00:03:54 Have you seen the concept art for All Star Superman?
Speaker 2 00:03:57 No. Show me
Speaker 1 00:03:59 They, have you seen this?
Speaker 2 00:04:01 Yeah. Okay. Yes, I've seen the, the, yeah. The spinal joints. Yeah. Those are brilliant
Speaker 1 00:04:07 Uhhuh. So, so like, as, as as Clark Kent, uh, for All Star Superman, the comic, he, he's like really hunched over and then as Superman, he's like, standing up straight. So that, that's kinda what you're talking about, right?
Speaker 2 00:04:17 Yeah, that's exactly it. It's those points of reference that you can see on the spine where it curves in like right near the cut. That's the part that is just like, he pushes himself forward. Like he pronounces himself brings that radiance to the situation whenever he shows up.
Speaker 1 00:04:32 Yeah. I I love the alter ego too. Vic, what about you? What's your history with Superman
Speaker 3 00:04:37 First movie? Super Permanent Returns? I mean, I liked it. It was, it was okay. I mean, I still love it. Um, but when I watched it when I was a kid, it was just okay. I wasn't fanboying or freaking out about it. But nowadays, when I watch it, I really appreciate it. I watched every single Superman live action movie, even the first one with, uh, George Rifs or Alan? Alan, Alan Kirk? Yeah.
Speaker 2 00:05:06 Oh, wow. Oh, the old, old one. Wow. Yeah,
Speaker 3 00:05:08 They were, let's not talk about them <laugh>. They, they, they were rough. It was pretty rough for me to watch them. And I didn't love Superman. I thought he was a really, really annoying scout boy. Like, I remember that when I watched Captain America for the first time, it was like I compared those two characters because, because they're basically like the same character. Mm-hmm. But mm-hmm. Different. And Captain America wasn't as annoying as Superman because he sometimes knew that he has to break the rules and Superman didn't want to do it. And, uh, it was so annoying. But when my favorites, one of my favorite superhero directors, uh, came and created Men of Steel, then that changed because it really broke this, you know, the ETOs of Superman, like what he stood for and everything. And I feel like I prefer the darker versions of superheroes, like the more mature ones. Mm-hmm. <affirmative> like the more serious ones. And I really love what he did with Superman, and that's why. Okay. I understand why people love, love Christopher Reeves. Uh, why people love Brandon Roof. I love Brandon Roof as Superman. Uh, his last appearance as Superman three years ago was, uh, it was perfect
Speaker 1 00:06:36 In crisis, right?
Speaker 3 00:06:37 Yeah. In crisis Earths. Yeah. But I don't know if I had to say that. Okay. I like Superman. He is okay. Like, he's not one of my favorite superhero characters. He is not even my top five DC characters, but it's okay. His interpretation, his, um, adaptation in live action is acceptable for me. I like it. I don't have problems with it, but sometimes I think that people should, you know, should think about what those movies represent and what was the director's vision and not what the characters stood in comics for. Like, he wasn't Boy Scout in comics, in comic books, but he doesn't have to be in the story. It's different story. It touches different points in his, I don't know, in his mentality or whatever you want to call it. And yeah. <laugh>, that's about it.
Speaker 1 00:07:37 Something that's really interesting when you compare Superman to Batman, I would say like Batman is one of the most versatile characters ever created, right? You can have like a goofy cartoon Batman, and you can have like Super City, serious gritty Batman, and both of them fans will love mm-hmm. <affirmative>, right? Batman's so versatile. You can do almost anything with him. And people like, alright, that's my Batman. Yeah. I mean, even to the point where like, you can have a huge live action movie where possibly he starts killing people, but it's because he's broken and people will say, oh, no, actually no, it makes sense. This is still a good Batman. So I, I but Superman, it's so controversial. It's so hard to get one Superman that almost everyone can agree with. Uh, I think we'll talk about it later, but I think that's one of the biggest challenges, um, in adapting Superman. Even in comics, it's hard to do one good Superman story. And I would say a lot of comics, sometimes they fall on nostalgia. They try to redo things from like the Christopher Reeve movie because they don't know mm-hmm. <affirmative> how to do a new Superman story. Yep. Um, well, we'll talk later.
Speaker 2 00:08:39 It's a little bit of fear. I think it's a little fear of doing a risk and seeing how the backlash should be, but yeah. So what's our next topic? We, uh, oh, no's. Well, no, I was gonna say you, I still need to know your history.
Speaker 1 00:08:50 Yeah. So I, I probably have the longest history and I'm surprised for that, that the reason for that is, I don't know, man, I got lucky as a kid or something. Uh, Superman, the movie was one of my very first v h s tape as a kid, and I grew up as the animated series was coming out, and I was watching it as it was coming out. So like, from Birth, Superman was like, bled like, it, it was like connected like an IV line into my d n a, uh, so, so I grew up with the Reve movies. I grew up with the animated series. Uh, then I grew up with Justice League, justice League Unlimited, uh, when I got a little bit older, then I discovered the show Smallville, and I was like, I'd always thought Smallville, like, that's the name of Superman's Town. But I was like, no way. There's a TV show about it. This is just me being dumb. And then I was like, no, there is a show. Why did Nobody Tells me There's a show? It's a whole show.
Speaker 2 00:09:41 <laugh> <laugh>.
Speaker 1 00:09:44 Because I, because I used to see ads for it on WB after the cartoon and I
Speaker 2 00:09:48 All the time,
Speaker 1 00:09:49 But I was like, the, this, like Smallville, this could be Superman, but I don't think it is. And then I got older, older, I was like, no, no, no. This is Superman, isn't it? So I started watching that with my mom and that became part, you don't
Speaker 2 00:10:00 Remember the promos where he would run past? Yeah. You didn't figure it out then.
Speaker 1 00:10:04 Eventually I did, eventually
Speaker 2 00:10:07 My Heart.
Speaker 1 00:10:08 But like me and my mom, Smallville was like our show. Like, we would, we would like record it. Like you had to record it if, if you couldn't, if you couldn't be there. Um, one time we had his, I had a friend over for a sleepover, and his mom said, uh, that show looks too scary for you. So we had our friend turn around so that we could watch this, this Thursday night premiere of a new episode. <laugh>. Like, this was our religion. So, so we watched all of Smallville, um,
Speaker 2 00:10:34 It's all the Jins out there. Back in the day, you couldn't just pull stuff up on the man if you weren't on with your ass on the couch at 7:30 PM Central Time, you had to wait for a rerun and you'd have to go through the TV guide, figure out what day that was coming. I know, it's a very scary thought, but we made it to the world of streaming. Yeah. I just want you to know how blessed y'all are.
Speaker 1 00:10:52 Yeah, I, I I mean, I still remember it was Thursday seven Central.
Speaker 2 00:10:56 Exactly. Yeah. That's Wired
Speaker 1 00:10:58 <laugh> 15 years ago or something. I
Speaker 2 00:11:01 Know, I remember. Bay Lates 7:30 AM on Saturdays.
Speaker 3 00:11:04 Yeah. Oh man. Yeah. Spider-Man, 1994. <laugh>.
Speaker 1 00:11:09 Think you weren't around then, <laugh>.
Speaker 3 00:11:12 No, but they played it in Poland, like with, I dunno, it was 2006, 2007.
Speaker 1 00:11:19 Oh my gosh. Oh yeah,
Speaker 2 00:11:21 Dude, there used to be a whole block from like just two and a half hours. Wb, you know, you'd have like Pokemon, uh, Shalin Showdown, Batman, the animated series, Batman Beyond Justice League, Superman. You'd get Static Shock
Speaker 1 00:11:34 Ec, static Shock,
Speaker 2 00:11:35 Ecstatic Shock. Oh my God. I could talk about Static Shock. Yeah. Another day. Another day. Yeah.
Speaker 1 00:11:40 Sorry. So anyway, so, so we went through all of Smallville. Um, during that time, Superman Returns came out and I watched that and I, I liked it, but I could also tell there's something weird about it that, that didn't, so there's some stuff about it that just seemed wrong to me, even though I was so young at the time. Um, it just seemed a little bit weird. Um, and then after returns then, you know, we all waited and then there was Man of Steel, and I was so excited for it. I still think the Man of Steel Trailers are some of the greatest, uh, Superman adaptation ever. Just the trailer, like the story it tells, especially Han Zimmer's music, like if you just listen to the score, it tells the story of this humble boy who grows up to do these action heroic things. And it, it's all there.
Speaker 1 00:12:23 And his piano and the guitars and the drums, the music is fantastic. Um, but I didn't like the next Snap and then Batman v Superman happened. And I, it just, I was losing the connection. Uh, but I love Henry Capital. I think he could have been an amazing, perfect Superman, but just the material I, I feel wasn't there for him. Um, but right now we, we'll talk about it in a second. There's two fantastic versions of Superman on TV right now that we're gonna talk about. I, I can't wait. 'cause Superman is back, baby Superman's back. Uh, also, I, I've checked out the old stuff. I've checked out, uh, checked out George Reeves, I've checked out the Max Flesher cartoons. I've checked out, I've checked out a little bit of the radio show even. Um, I would
Speaker 2 00:13:07 Say the radio shows are pretty solid, honestly, for those listening, I recommend them too. It's got all that bravado, like here comes the speeding <inaudible>, you know, like that, that used to be fun, you know, for some people, all their entertainment was sit there Friday night and listen to it. Yeah. It's, they, they're good. They're good. You riding in the car, you can listen to one on the way to work.
Speaker 1 00:13:26 Mm-hmm. <affirmative>. Yeah. And you know, these, these kind of radio programs are even coming back now as podcasts.
Speaker 2 00:13:30 In podcasts. It's the
Speaker 1 00:13:31 Same idea from 70 years ago. But, so it, it, it's a really interesting time is a
Speaker 2 00:13:35 Flat circle, my friend. Yeah,
Speaker 1 00:13:37 It's a really interesting new experience though. Check that out. And maybe, maybe they'll make new ones. I know they did a recent Batman radio shows Batman mm-hmm.
Speaker 2 00:13:43 <affirmative>. Yeah.
Speaker 3 00:13:44 Yeah. But One Button one has the audio show on Spotify,
Speaker 2 00:13:47 I think. Yeah. On on H b o Max as well. Yeah. It's cool. I mean, it's, I, I love the fact that they're thinking, Hey, there's more mediums. I'm, you know, me guys, you know what I love to do? I love to play video games. I'm just hoping one day we get a good Superman game to play. The only thing that Slightly Yeah. Scratched the surface was injustice. But yeah, that doesn't even count because, well, for those who know injustice, the whole spoiler thing is, yeah. We didn't do a spoiler warning in the beginning. We forgot that. It's okay. But moving forward, there will be spoilers on Yeah.
Speaker 1 00:14:20 For the new stuff. Yeah.
Speaker 2 00:14:21 For the new stuff that is coming out. So just your warnings right there. So,
Speaker 3 00:14:24 So just check, uh, the 85 years of history of Man of Steel and Comeback <laugh>.
Speaker 2 00:14:30 Yeah. Moving forward, we'll be discussing spoilers, but I would like to see in some way they, them adapt that evil Superman, you know, like the Red Sun's a good one, but even then they kind of at the end petered it out, if I recall correctly. Like they course corrected and made him a good guy or something. Yeah. Mm-hmm. <affirmative>, it's, it's,
Speaker 2 00:14:51 It's just the one thing. He hasn't been done justice. And for such a big character, it really sucks because yeah, when the Unreal Engine five came out, one guy programmed a demo where he was flying around Metropolis, vin, I need to show you that video. 'cause your jaw would drop. Yeah. Like, you would want to drop everything right now to go play it because it looked that good. Except how do you scale a character of that power level? That's why the past games have failed, because you can't, it's kind of unbeatable. So that's one thing. It's the
Speaker 3 00:15:21 Same one with the Flash.
Speaker 2 00:15:23 Yeah. It's, it's, it's not impossible, but it's a very weird task. You have to find a innovative gameplay. Something to make that work.
Speaker 3 00:15:35 Yeah. That's the closest you get is Lego Games,
Speaker 1 00:15:39 <laugh>. It's true. Man
Speaker 2 00:15:41 I's never gonna talk, talk about Superman. 64, just, no.
Speaker 3 00:15:45 Yeah. Those, those little, uh, circles. Just like in Harry Potter. Yeah. <laugh>.
Speaker 1 00:15:52 All right. Let's move on a bit. Um, so our next section is Superman Comics. Um, let's start, let's start with Vic. What were some of your, what are some of your favorite Superman comics?
Speaker 3 00:16:03 Well, my personal favorite is because I recently watched the, you know, the Superpowered, the mm-hmm. <affirmative> DC documentary that's coming out. And I really love The Death of Superman. Okay. Like, it's my favorite story after watching, uh, this documentary, because I didn't care much about Superman comic books. Like maybe in the last, in the last years, like, I started reading them recently, like actively, 'cause I didn't care much about this character a lot. And after watching Smallville mm-hmm. <affirmative>, uh, after watching Snyder Cat and all that, and after Superman, Lois, I really started loving this character, uh, in some way in my own way. And Death of Superman is very classic story. It was the very, Hmm. It was a very controversial story back in the day. 'cause I remember even in this documentary, people, people were saying, well, they killed Superman because it was, his stories, his adventures were really boring. And they had to do something really, really to
Speaker 1 00:17:18 Spike up the sales.
Speaker 3 00:17:20 Yeah, yeah, exactly. To boost the sales. And I don't know why, but I feel like you'll never beat, like, in some way, you'll never beat the, the story of Superman, of his death because mm-hmm. <affirmative>, it worked back in the day, but now you'd have to, I don't know, make a lot of movies, a lot of shows, a lot of animated episodes to, to really make, to, to, to let, to make people, to start caring about Superman. And I think that Dev of Superman, it was brutal. It was intriguing, it was emotional. So yeah, dev of Superman is my favorite.
Speaker 1 00:18:08 What about, um, recently, Vic, you, you did a review for us about, uh, the son of Superman, right?
Speaker 3 00:18:14 Oh, yeah. I thought,
Speaker 2 00:18:15 Yeah.
Speaker 3 00:18:16 I thought we were talking about Clark can only
Speaker 1 00:18:18 No, I think Superman.
Speaker 2 00:18:19 No, just Superman. Kind of like the, the whole topic.
Speaker 3 00:18:22 Oh, okay. Yeah.
Speaker 2 00:18:22 So, yeah. No, no, no. Please. Yeah.
Speaker 3 00:18:24 So John, Ken's stories is also really, really good. I really loved it. And
Speaker 2 00:18:30 It was the one you recently did, right? It was,
Speaker 3 00:18:32 Yeah, it was, uh, and I really, sometimes I really prefer John instead of Claude. Really? Yeah. Why? Yeah. I think his more, I, I don't know how to say it, but I feel more like John instead of Clark. Mm-hmm. <affirmative>. 'cause John is more like me. He's more, he, he's, he's a teenager. Okay. He's teen. He's young. Yeah. Yeah. I'm 23, almost 24. And I'm calling myself teenager. Yeah. <laugh>.
Speaker 2 00:19:03 But, but still, at the end of the day, you're, you relate more to a younger character with those powers versus someone who's actually been an established adult who works a professional job at a big, you know, company. And that's like un understandable. That's definitely more relatable to you in, in that sense.
Speaker 3 00:19:16 Exactly. I'm, I'm like, John, I'm trying to find myself. I don't know what to do in the future. I I really try to con I, I really connected with him. But
Speaker 2 00:19:27 Isn't that so inspiring that even you as a person have something relatable to someone that's literally Superman? Yeah. Like, that's what I love about Spider-Man. He has love life problems. He's got rent problems, like Right, right. We've been there, like, and, and it's cool that someone's so powerful in this case, like you is, he's kind of searching for what purpose, I guess. And so are you like that's the beauty, the parallels. Yeah, exactly.
Speaker 3 00:19:46 Yeah. But it's funny, uh, because you thought that I would connect with the older versions of the characters, and as you said, spider-Man. Uh, my favorite Spider-Man in live action is Toby. But in overall it's al Okay. It's 50 50, 0, 50 year old guy who plays 20 something. Wow. Spider-Man. Wow. Yeah. Yeah. It's, it's awesome. And John Cant is also young. So I think that in my case at least, I love those, I love all of those characters. But when I have to connect with someone, it's like, it's versions from 10, at least Max, 15 years ago. Mm-hmm. <affirmative>. Yeah. Yeah. The same goes for the same goes for Grand Augustine, the same goes for Ben Affleck. Like the, the newer, the newer versions are, yeah. They are better for me at, in some ways, at least
Speaker 1 00:20:46 For a lot of people. I think that's the disconnect with Christopher Reeve, that it's just 50 years ago. That, that's hard. Um, I, I think with John Kent also, um, like when, when you think of Clark Kent, you think of Superman, it feels almost rigid. 'cause you know exactly who it should be. And you, it, it feels like it's, it's too hard to shake the mold and he's too perfect. But with, with John Kent's, like, his future's still uncertain. His character is still being defined. So it feels it's a little bit and maybe more freeing that you can relate to him or his stories. The stories you can do. Because it, it's still being written. It, it's such a new character. Um, when we get to Superman and Lois, I think that's one of the most exciting things that they do with the kids. 'cause we don't know the future for them. Um, yeah. Vic, did you have any other Superman comics you wanted to plug? Hmm. Just those two.
Speaker 3 00:21:34 I mean, injustice is really interesting. Okay. And this one is one of my favorite stories because I also love the games, so mm-hmm. <affirmative>. Yeah. And I think Injustice too is one of the best stories ever told in the
Speaker 1 00:21:45 C And it's the same writer. It's the same writer, yeah. From the son of Cal L Series. Yeah. Tom Taylor.
Speaker 3 00:21:50 Exactly. So, yeah. So that's good. I'm still waiting for injustice free <laugh>.
Speaker 2 00:21:55 Hey man, aren't we all, you know? Yeah.
Speaker 3 00:21:57 I, I
Speaker 2 00:21:58 Have a good feeling it's gonna happen just not any, anytime soon. Yes. I mean, what James Gunn at some point said that they were gonna try to make projects that connected. Not to say that injustice would be connected. Let me clarify that now. So no one misunderstands me. 'cause I do not want this anywhere on Twitter or shit. But what I'm saying is they, there's still a demand. I mean, one of the best gaming franchise gaming or recently put out or the Batman games, those are beautiful. Yeah. Those, those Akin games were just well done. A lot of awards. Yeah. So you can make a good amount of money on video games. They've got a couple coming out. Um, injustice feels like a safe one to come out at some point. Just whenever they have the time. I mean, they're working what, on Mortal Kombat 11? Or they just finished it? I
Speaker 3 00:22:39 Mean, no Mortal Kom one is will release. Oh, the new one. Yeah. In two months.
Speaker 2 00:22:45 So they're going to probably be opened up to something,
Speaker 3 00:22:48 Something new. Yeah. I mean, injustice free. There are, there are ev there, there are evidence. Yeah. To I've seen it. Proof. Yeah. That it's so more. And I found some, I don't know if I can say it, but I found some like info that are certain characters to appear in, in this like constant. So Yeah. So that's
Speaker 2 00:23:10 Really cool. Yeah.
Speaker 3 00:23:11 But I think it'll take at least two, three years for them to make it. Yeah. Or, or maybe less 'cause more Combat 11, it was released five years ago or four years. Yeah. Yeah. But it takes a lot of time to, to create games like this. 'cause mostly what's important to this games, the, the most important thing in this games is story like. Yeah. Yeah. The story is most important. And rendering of those things in four K, those cinematics. So Yeah. Yeah.
Speaker 1 00:23:42 I feel like, I feel like a major lesson, a major takeaway from this podcast will be James Gunn. Please make a Superman video game.
Speaker 2 00:23:49 <laugh> just make some more games. I mean, he's saying he is doing it, but like, are beautiful narrative devices. I, I could go on days that some stories that impacted me that were video games where they didn't say a single word. No. One I'm thinking of is Journey. Play that game and come back and tell me, and you'll be like, that was incredible. Sometimes you don't have to say anything. Mm-hmm. <affirmative>. But, uh, let's get back to Superman. Yeah.
Speaker 1 00:24:08 All right. So Anthony, what were some of your favorite Superman comics? What have you been
Speaker 2 00:24:12 Reading? I've only read two. And you actually wrote about one of them. Uh, you wrote about, what was it? Um, all Star Superman. And I think
Speaker 1 00:24:21 Actually Carolann wrote that one, one of our, one of our special guest writers. Carolann.
Speaker 2 00:24:25 I thought you wrote that.
Speaker 1 00:24:26 No, I, I helped edit it.
Speaker 2 00:24:28 I'm all over the place. But
Speaker 1 00:24:29 She did, she did a fantastic, fantastic writeup for All Star. What'd you think of it? Of
Speaker 2 00:24:34 The, the group? I, I'm, that was probably my favorite. It's so tied with Superman for all seasons. Yes. Because I think what I like is the simplicity where it's he grassroots is what I'm trying to say. Yeah. In, in All star Superman. You know what? I like to see him cross the country interacting and doing things of all labors. 'cause there was the one where he stopped and helped out that one city that was struggling. Yeah. Because they lost all production. That was probably one of my favorite stories I've ever seen. Just in general, because he cares even about the little guy. A bit interesting how much of a trek it was and how mysterious he was about it. But I still enjoyed it. And then the other one I'm gonna move on to now, it's Superman for all seasons. That one I truly, truly love with my entire heart.
Speaker 2 00:25:23 Yeah. I'd say it for all seasons is my favorite. Yeah. That panel where he drops the hat or the kids, you know, he picks it up and he is like, thanks. My mom made it for me. And it made it into Superman. And Lois, I still haven't seen the show. Sorry, Brian. But the fact that it's so iconic that they used it was neat. And it's a beautiful shot. You know, it's got him just simply standing there, holding onto this little cap. And this little boy's just looking at him with the grandeur in his eyes. Like he's just like, wow. And, um, I've always just really enjoyed interfamilial relationships, like how he interacts with his mom, how he interacts with Lois. Like that's what matters to me. And in that one, he really stayed close with his mom. I think that's what it is. I really love my mom, y'all. It's just, it made me think of her. And it, it is just so sweet that he goes back and checks on her. I love. And the art style, uh, I love the art style, that combo of Loeb and, and sale just Chef's Kiss. Always.
Speaker 1 00:26:19 You read long Halloween,
Speaker 2 00:26:21 Of course. And I even went and bought it before the Batman came out. I bought the little box set that came with Ego Tales year one and all that. I'm so glad. <crosstalk>, it's so short. You can read it in like an hour. Like it's absolutely worth the time.
Speaker 1 00:26:34 Yeah. And, uh,
Speaker 2 00:26:35 Thank you for the recommendation, I must say. Yeah.
Speaker 1 00:26:37 I'm about to give you another one. So this week, so, so I'll start, uh, for all, for all Seasons is was for years. Years, years. It was my number one Superman rec. I, uh, I don't like All Star as much as most people do. Like, I, I can understand why it's great. I understand why it's important. Yes. The, the page where he saves the girl from falling off the building.
Speaker 2 00:26:59 I didn't wanna mention that one. Yeah, yeah. But that, that's, but it's a good one.
Speaker 1 00:27:01 It's classic. And there's so many great things about Allstar, but it, it's kind of cold. It's kind of emotionless, it's kind of, um, I mean it's emotional, but the reading experience of it, sometimes there, there's something, some kind of disconnect for me. And you
Speaker 2 00:27:14 Just go through the motions, right? Yeah.
Speaker 1 00:27:15 Like, you just, it's, it's so big and so sci-fi and sometimes it's difficult just to follow the heart of the story. I don't know my experience, but for all seasons it's full of heart and it's full of love. And that small town feeling of him and his relationship with Lois, his relationship Ana, his relationship with his
Speaker 2 00:27:33 Mom, Lana. That's what I was thinking about. Yeah. That was the other part that really got me when he went back to town. Yeah, yeah. Things like that.
Speaker 1 00:27:39 Yeah. But, uh, this week I just finished yesterday. It's a new comic by Tom King called Superman Up in the sky. And this is, it, it's structured similarly to All Star kind of where it's like, uh, it's, it's a narrative broken into short stories. So it's kind of the greatest challenges of Superman, um, on his quest to save one girl. So just one girl. Nothing special about her, but she, she's just in trouble. And in order to save this one normal little girl, he has to travel around the whole universe and go through, uh, I think there's 14 challenges for something. And they're the most greatest. Grandest the biggest, but it's all driven.
Speaker 2 00:28:17 You know what this sounds like,
Speaker 1 00:28:18 What
Speaker 2 00:28:18 Hercules?
Speaker 1 00:28:19 Yeah. Yeah. Well that, that was the, that was the pitch for Allstar too. It was like Superman's Hercules. But I, I, for me, me personally, I thought up in the sky, I, I connected to that more than I did in Allstar, I think up in the sky. And it, it does the big cosmic, uh, like, uh, super, super heroic Superman in a way that for all seasons didn't do. So if you take for all seasons and you take up in the sky, I think those are like the two perfect Superman recommendations for me for comic readers. Um,
Speaker 2 00:28:50 And they're short too. Both of them. Both
Speaker 1 00:28:53 Of them are very short. Yeah.
Speaker 2 00:28:53 You could read both of them in like in two hours.
Speaker 1 00:28:56 Yeah. Up in the Sky is only six issues for all seasons is four. It's
Speaker 2 00:28:59 Four. Yeah.
Speaker 1 00:29:01 I think all Stars 12. So I, I would recommend that maybe as a third three, um,
Speaker 2 00:29:05 Also All Stars at seven or eight. It's short term. Okay.
Speaker 1 00:29:07 I, I, I don't remember. Um, I also like, um, uh, they call 'em called, uh, Superman Secret Identity. Have you guys heard of this?
Speaker 2 00:29:15 No. Enlightening.
Speaker 1 00:29:17 I I don't wanna spoil anything. Uh, this one is Okay. Not like any Superman comic you've read, but it is, it completely gets, wait. Is it
Speaker 3 00:29:26 This comic book where both Superman and Clark Ken are separate people?
Speaker 1 00:29:34 Kind of, kind of. I, I don't wanna, I don't wanna spoil. Um, but it, it's about like, what would Superman be like in the real world, kind of. Um, and it has a fantastic ending and it's really emotional and it's really about the inspiration of Superman and what he means to real people. Um, I don't wanna spoil, uh, this was one of my first Superman comics I think I read as a teenager. And it, it, it's really hard to live up to it. It's really something special. It's by Kurt, u c a, uh, you, you guys have to have to look it up later. Okay. Sure. That one's really good. Um, what are some I
Speaker 2 00:30:08 Need something to read on the hammock later
Speaker 3 00:30:10 Today. Yeah, yeah. Do
Speaker 1 00:30:11 <laugh> I'll, I'll send a list. Uh, what are your some of your favorite stories and ideas that you think should, should be adapted that haven't been yet?
Speaker 3 00:30:20 Wow. Okay. I think one of my favorite stories was already adopted in Christ and Infant Earths and it's Kingdom come. Mm-hmm. <affirmative>. Yeah. The Kingdom Come Superman. So that's it. But I think, Hmm. I drew of, yeah. Injustice was already adapting the animated form. I don't know, to be honest. 'cause
Speaker 1 00:30:45 I would say, I think it's strange there hasn't been a Kingdom come animated movie.
Speaker 3 00:30:49 Yeah. But is they've
Speaker 1 00:30:51 Done so many of the, they've some done so many. Yeah.
Speaker 2 00:30:52 They've so many Batman,
Speaker 1 00:30:53 Especially Batman stories. But Kingdom comes like, it's one of the greatest Justice League stories. Where is it?
Speaker 3 00:30:59 Yeah. You have Kingdom Camp Batman and Kingdom come Superman in Christ in Earth. But it's not like you have, you can see what happened and see the exact story. But still, and, and it's kind of funny that Christopher Rife's Superman was, was the Kingdom come Superman? Like, if you know what I mean? Because the brother and roof is
Speaker 1 00:31:19 In crisis. Yeah,
Speaker 3 00:31:20 Yeah. The, the Christopher Reversion and he continues the legacy and all that. And I think that's funny. But when it comes to the stories, I think, I don't know if you can adapt something like this in live action. 'cause you know, the, were really, they have to be
Speaker 1 00:31:36 Else world.
Speaker 3 00:31:37 Mm-hmm. Not only else words, but I feel like there's a lot of great stories. And if you want to do one, like you can just, you can't just take it from the comic books, like adapt the whole story from the one comic book story in into live action. But you have to take some elements. Just like, for example, Christopher Nolan did with Dark Knight Rises, he just adopted Dark Knight Returns. And Yeah. Just took some elements and used them because I mean, you had four Christopher Re movies. You had Kirk Allen, George Riv, you had, uh, Henry Calvin. Now, now you have Tyler Hackley, you had Tom Welling. And they all adapted some stories, took some elements from the comic books. But I feel that if you would take the whole story, it wouldn't make sense or it wouldn't work.
Speaker 1 00:32:34 Yeah, definitely. It needs to be polished. Like even like the new Flash movie, how they adapted flashpoint differently. Yeah. Thank gosh, I, I, so everything good and bad, the movie aside, I at least appreciated that, you know, it's like probably the fourth or fifth version of Flashpoint we've had in 10 years. Oh. But I appreciate that it felt fresh, yeah's, because you have the comic movie TV show and then,
Speaker 3 00:32:58 And now the movie live action
Speaker 1 00:32:59 Movie. So I appreciate that it still felt fresh, that it wasn't just the same story, that they made changes to it and they made it fit the D C E U, you know, successes, failures aside that. I, I appreciated that. It it was still original. Yeah. I agree. Um, let's, let's move on. So now we're gonna talk about, now we're gonna talk about the three new Superman we have going on. We have Superman and Lois. We have My Adventures of Superman and Superman legacy. Um, Superman and Lois. This is, uh, a CW show connected to the Arrowverse, but it's really standalone. It doesn't need any pre watching. You can just jump in season one. Episode one. Uh, they just finished their third season. And I'll tell you lads, I think this third season will go down in history is one of the most emotional Superman stories ever told. Vic, have you been watching it?
Speaker 3 00:33:52 Bro? Do you really have to ask me this question? It's like a rhetorical question.
Speaker 1 00:33:56 Like, are are, are you, you're caught up, right? Right.
Speaker 3 00:33:58 Yeah, bro, I was watching you.
Speaker 1 00:34:00 Am I, am I exaggerating? What, what are what are your, what's your relationship with Superman and Lois?
Speaker 3 00:34:04 It, it's one of the best Superman shows. It's like, I think it's the best. I love Smallville, but Superman and Lo really emotional. I mean, it's all because of season three. Season three is one of the best, not only superhero seasons of shows, but overall it's really emotional. It it's story about Clark, Ken and his family and not Superman. And not only about him, but it's only about Lois, about his kids. And I feel like they perfectly balanced, uh, the story between showing what Superman struggles with and what Clark Ken struggles with. Yeah. But I really miss showing Clark Ken because movies, they basically focused on Superman. Like you, you didn't have a chance to see what Clark can do, what his family life looks like. And Well, season three just broke me. It broke me in tears. Almost every episode brought me to tears. And I'm not exaggerating. It was so emotional. Yeah.
Speaker 1 00:35:13 I, I wrote like a, I think a 2000 word review. I think when the season ended. Like I just, and I, I wrote the whole thing in one day. 'cause I just, I had so much to say. I, I was busy. I, I didn't have time that day, but I made the time because that show, that season means so much to me. We, we can't spoil. Um, rad may be off air. I'll, I'll tell you generally what, what it's about. But yeah,
Speaker 3 00:35:34 We, we can tell what it's about because
Speaker 1 00:35:36 It's No, no, because it's not even out in, in certain parts of the world, I think. Oh yeah. It's too new. And it just ended like a week ago or something. Um, but, but the, the show is really good. Basically it's Superman. Um, slightly passed his prime and he settled down in Smallville with Lois. They have two kids. Uh, one kid has superpowers, the other doesn't. So half the family is superhero, half the family is normal. And it, it is returning Superman to his small bull roots. But while keeping him as Superman, 'cause he's still doing Superman things. Meanwhile, his son is a teenager and he's going through the whole small bull art. He, he's a teenager. He wants to be on the football team. He's trying to date girls, but he is also dealing with superpowers. So it's everything you loved about Smallville plus everything you love about Superman, uh, and everything you love about Lois. All in one fantastic package. I would say it, it takes pretty much everything Smallville did and makes it better. I think the only, uh, Smallville did a few things better. Like, I think Smallville had a, the perfect, Lex Smallville had a fantastic mom <inaudible>. Um, but for the most part, I think Superman and Lois just is improved and it's an improvement. It's like Smallville 2.0. It's my favorite Superman adaptation since Donner. So Red, you, you have to check it out this summer. All right, man.
Speaker 2 00:36:52 Sounds good.
Speaker 1 00:36:53 It, it's a fantastic show. It's like, uh, 50 episodes right now. So
Speaker 2 00:36:58 43 is what I'm counting.
Speaker 1 00:36:59 Okay. It, it's, it's, it's good. It's really good. And, and, and each season basically turns into a giant movie event. Mm-hmm. <affirmative>. So even though there's 15 episodes, 10 of them just connects together. Like one humongous epic Superman
Speaker 2 00:37:13 Movement, one big arc.
Speaker 3 00:37:14 Yeah. You, you can skip season two, you can skip season two. <laugh>.
Speaker 1 00:37:18 I, I think even season two has, has stuff I like, so it's the weakest. But
Speaker 3 00:37:23 I like the first half of the season two, but Oh, I
Speaker 1 00:37:27 Remember. I like the second half better <laugh>.
Speaker 3 00:37:29 But I really love the last episode with the SunPower. I'm gonna Yeah, yeah,
Speaker 1 00:37:35 Yeah.
Speaker 3 00:37:35 Well the Sun SunPower scene, it was awesome. Yeah. Straight from the comic. Superman
Speaker 1 00:37:40 And Superman and Los, nobody, so many Superman fans are scared of it. 'cause it's cw. I didn't watch it for years because it's CW and I'm not a huge, like, I don't, it's too much cw The Arrowverse is too much to keep up with. Yeah. But this show, it's standalone. It's movie quality. It's fantastic. Fantastic.
Speaker 2 00:37:56 I love that opener. That opener goes right back to, uh, for all seasons with, uh, hey, my mom made it for me. And it even shows them doing the iconic action comics pose from the original first appearance of Superman, where he holds up that green car. So it's neat. It is. They did their homework. They, they, they respect and love the source material. I haven't watched that much, but from what I've heard and talked about and what I've seen with you, Brian, everybody, there's a lot in that show. I just haven't watched it. 'cause I was waiting for it to finish and it's, it's done now. And I'll find some period that I'll, where it's slow and I don't have something.
Speaker 3 00:38:27 Yeah. I'll binge it. It'll take some time. Yeah. It'll take some time for season four to come out.
Speaker 2 00:38:32 I didn't know they were doing it for season, but cool.
Speaker 1 00:38:35 Possibly a but definitely a fourth one. Yeah.
Speaker 3 00:38:38 Season four in season five.
Speaker 1 00:38:40 But, but now with, with budget cuts, uh, season four might look very different. They're, they're reducing the cast a lot, so, and I
Speaker 3 00:38:46 Think it's for the better.
Speaker 2 00:38:48 There's also the strike going on right now, so we'll have to see how anything and everything goes. We're in a very unpredictable and odd moment. I mean, I feel that 2008 feeling all over again. Yeah.
Speaker 3 00:38:57 Heroes.
Speaker 1 00:38:59 Yeah.
Speaker 3 00:38:59 Funny thing. You had,
Speaker 2 00:39:01 You know, the Yeah. You know, that's my trigger. Yeah. Like, that's the one thing that
Speaker 3 00:39:04 Upsets me. I'm planning on watching it.
Speaker 2 00:39:08 It's still in that first season is still something awesome. But Yeah. But, uh, the next one we're talking about is mine. Right? My adventures with Superman. Okay. So we can only say so much 'cause there's only three episodes out. But me and Ben got to watch seven so far. I haven't checked for the last three chefs, but it was a lot of fun. I watched them over one afternoon. Um, it scratches and itch. I didn't know I had mm-hmm. <affirmative>, I didn't know I needed anime Superman. But now that I have him, I want him to stick around and I want him to be here next year and the year after that. I mean, it's so fitting. Like, think about the styles of anime when you get the fights. Like I was thinking about Naruto 'cause mm-hmm. <affirmative> and just those action scenes. There's a reason why anime's so beloved because it's awesome.
Speaker 2 00:39:51 Right, right. Yeah. Right Alex, right Alex. That, that one's for you Bud <laugh>. But, um, to them, turn it on its head and, and present it in a different way. I love it. And I don't have this huge attachment and feeling of what Superman has to be or what I want 'em to be. And since I went in with that mentality, it made it so much better. Um, VIN and I privately discussed this, but the only thing that we agree on that's off is that when Jack Quaid does his Superman voice, there's literally no difference between that and Clark Kent.
Speaker 1 00:40:26 I've thought about it and I wonder if maybe that's part of the, the character development, maybe because he's still so, he's still so new as Superman. Maybe.
Speaker 2 00:40:34 And that's what I was thinking. We don't have those last three. Maybe there's something, but no offense to Jack Quaid. 'cause I'm a big fan of him. But, you know, the, his voice is Superman to me was like the most, eh, but it's okay. Like, everything else makes up for it. Um, and looking at it, thinking about the episode that came out this weekend, the Scoop troop, that's what I'm gonna call Lizzie and Alex now. They're the Scoop troop. <laugh>. That's right. I'm not calling you on nothing else. Um, what I wonder is, I'm sorry,
Speaker 1 00:41:03 I was saying Vic, have you seen the show? Have you been, uh,
Speaker 3 00:41:06 <crosstalk>? Yeah. Uh, I could have. I only seen those three episodes. Mm-hmm. <affirmative>,
Speaker 1 00:41:11 What, what do you think? So far?
Speaker 3 00:41:12 It's just Okay. Yeah. I'm not a fan of anime. Okay. Okay. It's really, it was really hard for me to watch it. Like, yeah. I, I don't know. I had this weird thing that it's all, I don't wanna use the word childish because it's like childish. No, it's okay.
Speaker 2 00:41:29 It's silly. Yes. It, it's definitely a lot of silliness and it's, but that's what I'm saying. It's like anime. It has these super serious, big action moments, fighting sequences that are go on. And then you have a moment where there's somebody off making this like, huge eye expression and
Speaker 1 00:41:42 The blushing.
Speaker 2 00:41:43 Yeah, exactly. They have the little dots and everything. It, it's neat. I mean, I watched lots of, of anime. It's so, like, that's just standard. There has to be a balance too. I mean, I love super serious, but like, it, it sells the moments where shit goes down a lot more when he is having those more heartfelt moments with Lois and Jimmy, which Jimmy Olsson being a conspiracy. Jimmy Olson is weird, but I find it. I like it. I, I mean, I like it. It's just weird. But I like it.
Speaker 1 00:42:13 If, if you, if you go back to the Silver Rage, like even, even before Jack Kirby. Yeah. This is, this is like the perfect Jimmy Olsson. Okay. All you need is, is season two. He starts turning into creatures. That's all you need in season two. Now that's the next step. So he, if he first, like, he's a conspiracy theorist, he thinks there's all these strange things out there. Is it true? Is it not true? Then you need him to discover, oh, there is strange things out there. And then he starts going on these science trips and he starts experimenting. So I think that could be the progression in season two. Mm-hmm. <affirmative>. But what they've already set up is the best Jimmy Olsson ever adapted in any film or TV show. If you go through the history, Jimmy Olsson has always gotten in the short straw. No one, no one really respects him enough. But my Adventures with Superman does. Um,
Speaker 2 00:42:58 Oh, uh, it comes out on Fridays right now. There's three episodes that are out, and I think there's a total of 10. So we've seen seven up to episode seven, which holy crap. Mm. So much to unpack there, uh, let's just say longtime Superman fans watch that episode. That's the one that you need to watch. And, um, go ahead.
Speaker 1 00:43:20 I, I think even, even for people like think, 'cause I, I'm sure there's lots of people out there who are like, I don't like the show, or I don't get it. I don't think it's for me. I'm telling you guys, episode six and seven, watch those watch episode six and seven. The August, the August episodes, the August episodes are going to blow you away. Even if you're not vibing with the show. Episode six and seven will, uh, so Vic, let's move on. After my Adventures with Superman, we have Superman legacy coming out in 2025. What's this about?
Speaker 3 00:43:51 Wow. That's a really good question, <laugh>, because we know that it will tell the story of Clark and Superman who's already working at work at Daily Planet, and there won't be any
Speaker 2 00:44:03 Aspects. No more origin stories, no more origin stories. Thank God I get it.
Speaker 3 00:44:10 Yeah. I, I really love this idea too, because I really don't want to see Papa Ken dying over and over again. No, just keep him alive. Yeah.
Speaker 2 00:44:19 No, he can be dead. But come on now. How many times have you seen Uncle Ben die? How many times have you seen PA Can't Die? Like, if you don't get it at this point, then you,
Speaker 3 00:44:27 I think he'll be
Speaker 2 00:44:28 Alive, been around that
Speaker 3 00:44:29 He'll be alive because they're casting him. So
Speaker 2 00:44:33 It might be a flashback, my friend.
Speaker 3 00:44:34 I hope not, because GaN said we won't be seeing Young Clark. And I think Papa Can't stink. Alive means more to Superman means more to the idea of Superman than him dying.
Speaker 1 00:44:50 I, I agree a hundred percent. I really like it. I'm okay with him dying. But I really like Superman comes home and he has his mom and his dad. Yeah. The animated series did that. And I, I really, I just, I really like that. That's really nice.
Speaker 2 00:45:01 I thought the whole point was that the lesson for him was that no matter how powerful you are, your Superman, there is some things that are just genuinely outta your control that you can't, you know, influence. Yeah.
Speaker 1 00:45:12 That lesson's important too. But I feel, I feel that comes anyway as he's growing up. Yeah. So I don't know, like there, there's pros and cons to it and it just depends what they want to Yeah. Uh, generally in Superman stories, if they focus on his origin probably can't die. Right. But they skip, if they skip over his origin or quickly, then p can't live.
Speaker 2 00:45:30 So there's some stories where he's actually alive because I mean like mm-hmm. <affirmative>. Yeah. But Spider-Man, uncle Ben is never alive. That's just not a thing. Thomas Martha, Wayne dead. So I'm just making sure I didn't,
Speaker 1 00:45:40 I didn't know that. Hear my adventures. Even in my adventures, PT is alive and Superman, the animated series, Paul Can't is alive
Speaker 3 00:45:46 Injustice in the
Speaker 1 00:45:47 Comics.
Speaker 2 00:45:47 You're right. I totally forgot about the Enemy series. He was alive. Okay. So, so, okay. Alright.
Speaker 1 00:45:52 In the comics, he was alive until, uh, like in post-crisis, he was alive until 2008.
Speaker 2 00:45:57 Oh, damn. And
Speaker 1 00:45:58 Then Jeff Johns killed him. So, so
Speaker 2 00:46:00 With him being alive in this movie, you think it'll be,
Speaker 3 00:46:03 I think he'll be alive. Yeah. Because look at this, when Superman turns evil, when Marta Ken dies and Papa Ken lives. So I think that keeping them both alive will be perfect because he'll be able to see Clark who doesn't know what to do, and he comes home and he ask his parents what he should do. And not only his mom, because they both represent, I think that Marta represents all the good there is in Superman and John McCann. Jonathan represents the,
Speaker 2 00:46:40 The righteousness.
Speaker 3 00:46:41 Not only the righteousness, but the more break the rules side sometimes. Yeah,
Speaker 2 00:46:47 I can see that. Yeah. I can see that
Speaker 3 00:46:49 You were able to see this in Men of Steel when, when uh Oh, Kevin Coston. Yeah, Kevin Coston price him and he said, you can't reveal yourself no matter what. These people are not ready for you. It's like basically saying let them die because they are not ready for you to save them. It's a really horrible thing, but when you think about it, it makes perfect sense because it shows you the balance and the, there is inside Clark, like between good and evil and becoming his own version of himself. And I really love it.
Speaker 1 00:47:24 That's a really interesting discussion about like, the importance of content. I think my favorite version of Mom and Pop was Smallville. I think they did the parents perfect.
Speaker 3 00:47:32 Perfect. Yeah, exactly. Yeah.
Speaker 2 00:47:34 I'm excited to see what they do with the parents in this time. Especially since we don't have to spend too much time in Smallville and being, you know, arriving on earth, getting in age. Like I love the fact that we're gonna skip all that because while it's cute seeing little, you know, but,
Speaker 1 00:47:49 But we know it.
Speaker 2 00:47:50 Yeah, exactly. We know it. I wanna see what the man's up to, what he's wanting to do. And they're with, with this incredible amount of casting of people they're adding. What the hell even is this movie guys <laugh>, like, what did they add the other day? They added, um, like four characters and like three of 'em I
Speaker 3 00:48:05 Heard of, they didn't have time to to announce the rest because of the strike.
Speaker 2 00:48:09 Right. So actually
Speaker 1 00:48:10 Can you give us the rundown? Can you tell us who are the, the characters that they added?
Speaker 3 00:48:14 Yeah. Okay. So of course we have David Cowe as Clark Ra, Rachel Nan. That's how
Speaker 2 00:48:20 Brosnahan
Speaker 3 00:48:21 Brosnahan me,
Speaker 1 00:48:22 Me and Anthony. We love her. She was
Speaker 2 00:48:24 A great, I'm, I've been in love with her for like 13 years. Y'all, she was a House of Cards. Uh, she played a character named Rachel, but she was powerful in that and she's done a great job. She's carried marvelous. Miss Maisel for Five Seasons. Love that show. She's gotten Amy's for it. Yeah. Yeah. I mean, when I saw her on the short list, I'm like, if there is a God great this, she's, she's the per go on her Instagram right now and tell me she's not the perfect lowest lane. She even dresses like her man. Like it's
Speaker 3 00:48:51 There. Yeah. I sent you the picture the other day from medical
Speaker 2 00:48:54 Tomorrow's. I'm just like,
Speaker 3 00:48:56 I'm still more of a, I'm a m casting guy type, but
Speaker 2 00:48:59 I think she would've been a great, another selection. I'm just, I think really happy I got Rachel. Exactly. Yeah,
Speaker 3 00:49:04 Yeah, yeah. Okay.
Speaker 2 00:49:05 But you know, James Gunn, every time he meets someone, he likes them. He keeps them in mind for another role. So we'll see her somewhere. Yeah.
Speaker 1 00:49:12 Oh, that's, that's a great thing to think about. Have ever noticed other people who weren't cast who like second thirds, maybe they'll come back later. Yeah, for
Speaker 2 00:49:18 Sure. No, for sure. There was a couple people, I'm just trying to remember who, but he, Nathan Ian, he didn't put 'em in until he had 'em as T d k <laugh>. He wanted 'em on a couple things, but it just didn't work out. So he finally put 'em in and then he finally put 'em in Guardians after that. He, you know, he likes to work with the same people. That's just how he is.
Speaker 3 00:49:35 Yeah, that's good. Because, you know, good and bad some, someone is good in one role than white accustom in another.
Speaker 2 00:49:41 Yeah, yeah.
Speaker 3 00:49:42 Of course we have
Speaker 1 00:49:45 Mm-hmm.
Speaker 3 00:49:45 <affirmative>. Yeah, we have Mercer as whole girl and I think it will be the one from the space, the Princess Shaara, uh, but we'll talk about it later, but et ti as Mr. Missed. Terrific. And it already sets up the terrific project, uh, to be one of the d c projects. And of course Nathan Fillon is Guy Gardner. We've all got Yeah, the, the, that's funny.
Speaker 2 00:50:10 First green, uh, lantern man. Yeah.
Speaker 3 00:50:14 Yeah. And
Speaker 2 00:50:15 What do you think Ryan Reynolds, that's been live action.
Speaker 1 00:50:18 Oh, and, and then who, who's the fourth one? Who's the fourth one?
Speaker 3 00:50:21 Uh, Anthony Carrigan is Metamorpho.
Speaker 1 00:50:24 All right. I wanna go back to Guy Gardner. What do you think about this casting? Nathan Fillon? Is Guy Gardner good or bad?
Speaker 2 00:50:31 The problem is, I don't know if about know enough about Guy Gardner, but I know Nathan Fillon as an actor, so I know what he's capable of and I think he'll handle it just fine. And I'm looking at the image and I'm actually really excited 'cause now when I see this stupid ball cut on his face. Yes, yes,
Speaker 1 00:50:44 Yes. Because he guy
Speaker 2 00:50:45 Gardner, he's the person that he'll own it. He is not gonna be like, yeah, okay, put your makeup. He is like, put it on me. Let's, let's, let's do the damn thing.
Speaker 1 00:50:53 Guy Gardner is kind of like, like the jerk asshole green lantern. Like he, he's the one with this big, big attitude problem.
Speaker 2 00:51:00 Wasn't he the one that was giving blue beetles shit he raised? Yeah. Okay. So yes, I'm a little familiar with the character. Yeah. He is a bit of a dick, so it's ki can feel you can do it. It's just gonna be weird. 'cause I see him as this big softie 'cause he is. Yeah. You know, but he
Speaker 3 00:51:14 Plays the best softie. Yeah.
Speaker 2 00:51:16 He plays the big softy, but he is one,
Speaker 1 00:51:18 I feel like he can fit that into guy's character. Maybe like, like his attitude is the hard outer show, but on the inside he's a softie. Yeah. We'll see how they interpret him. But I'm just excited that we're jumping to a green lantern who's not Hal Jordan. And that that's gonna be our first green lantern in this universe. And that, that gives me hope for a big green lantern universe. Yeah. Eventually that we'll have all the side characters that we, we haven't seen. So I'm really excited for that. Yeah.
Speaker 3 00:51:41 It'll be the fourth green lantern in live action, so that's
Speaker 2 00:51:45 Good. Fourth,
Speaker 3 00:51:45 Fourth, fourth. So we
Speaker 2 00:51:46 Had Ryan, the one in, we
Speaker 3 00:51:48 Have Ryan, then we have Lan go in Cyber Cat Uhhuh. Then we have Daughter of Alan Scott in Star Girl and now Guy Gardner. Oh,
Speaker 2 00:51:58 Okay.
Speaker 1 00:51:59 Uhhuh. Yeah. And I think Smallville teased Alan Scott I think you saw him for like
Speaker 3 00:52:04 Yeah. Yeah. He's on if speak, he's on the wall in, in the J ss a base.
Speaker 1 00:52:11 Yeah.
Speaker 3 00:52:13 Yeah.
Speaker 2 00:52:13 And then they have members of the authority, or did we mentioned those already?
Speaker 1 00:52:18 Yeah. So the rumors that there's gonna be members of the authority, even the Hollywood reporter has talked about this, but there's also rumors that it could be, it could be, uh, a misdirect that maybe it's not true.
Speaker 2 00:52:27 Oh.
Speaker 3 00:52:28 So yeah. But I don't, wait.
Speaker 2 00:52:29 Is that what the guy in the Discord that he keeps talking about, Vic? Is that what we're talking about? That,
Speaker 3 00:52:34 You know what I mean? But from what I know so far, they are in the movie and it's connected with the future D C U project that we know about. Okay. So, yeah. Cool. But I mean, the one casting that they didn't get the chance to announce his brain, they, they signed him few hours. I don't know if it lost few hours or few minutes after the strike started, but his, he is already signed. But it may change. And I, is it because
Speaker 1 00:53:05 They have some already,
Speaker 3 00:53:07 I already sent it to you.
Speaker 2 00:53:09 Where?
Speaker 1 00:53:11 Where?
Speaker 3 00:53:11 Hey Dial Craig.
Speaker 2 00:53:13 Oh.
Speaker 1 00:53:16 Oh,
Speaker 2 00:53:16 I thought he was Luther Man,
Speaker 3 00:53:18 I got that mixed up. No, they were looking for a, for a younger actor. Those were like, oh shit. I think it was Alexander Scars Guard or B Scars. Guard
Speaker 1 00:53:27 Uhhuh. I, I heard that. Or I think one of the train that they were looking at the scars guard for.
Speaker 3 00:53:32 Yeah. But I don't, but I don't think they will. I don't know if they'll keep Craig. 'cause I don't know what will happen during the strike. So Yeah.
Speaker 2 00:53:42 Who knows. But,
Speaker 3 00:53:44 But for now, he's the 99% brain. Yeah.
Speaker 1 00:53:47 That's a really interesting casting. Yeah. Can we keep this in the podcast?
Speaker 2 00:53:50 Yeah, I could.
Speaker 3 00:53:51 I could. I don't dunno. Okay. Yeah, probably can. Probably can. I dunno. Because if they, if they recast him, it'll be, oh no, he was wrong.
Speaker 1 00:53:59 Uhhuh. Alright. People
Speaker 2 00:54:01 Have been wrong before.
Speaker 3 00:54:02 Yeah.
Speaker 1 00:54:03 Coming back to this, what we have with these four heroes, we have Haw Girl, terrific. Uh, guy Gardner Metamorpho. It seems like a weird group, but you can draw a few connections with maybe the J s A because, uh, terrific and Haw Girl come from the j s a, maybe the j l I 'cause Guy Gardner. Uh, guy Gardner comes from the j l I, that's his, his big team.
Speaker 2 00:54:23 What's j l I I'm sorry. For those who don't
Speaker 1 00:54:25 Know Justice League internationally. Thank you. Uh, and this is, uh, from the 1980s. It's like a, a comedy justice league. So that's where you have Martian Man Hunter. You have Guy Garner, you have a fire and ice, you have a Blue Beetle Booster gold. And they just, they do silly stuff all the time. So it's really funny. But it's, I, I think it that's kind of perfect for a James Gunn universe.
Speaker 2 00:54:47 That's what I was just about to say. I'm like, but this is James Gunn. He loves comedy.
Speaker 1 00:54:51 Yeah, yeah, exactly.
Speaker 2 00:54:53 I'm picking up what you're putting down.
Speaker 3 00:54:54 <laugh>.
Speaker 1 00:54:55 Uh, Mr. Terrific. So he's connected to the J S A, but of course he's also connected to, he's connected to the Terrifics, which is, uh, a relatively new team. Um, there's four heroes. They're kind of based on the Fantastic Four, but they're completely their own thing. There's Mr. Terrific, there's Phantom Girl, there's Metamorpho, um, and there's plastic. So if you just look at their power sets, you kind of have a, like a kind of a phantom kind of character. You have a stretchy kind of character. Metamorpho is kind of like your thing. And Mr. Terrific is kind of like your, you're Mr. Fantastic because he is super smart.
Speaker 3 00:55:28 He's the smartest man alive.
Speaker 1 00:55:31 Yeah. Yeah. Um, even in, up in the sky. So Mr. Terrific. They always say he's the third smartest, I think, behind Lex and Bruce. Uh, but in, up in the Sky, uh, a little girl asked Superman is, is, uh, Batman really smarter than Mr. Terrific. And Superman says, no, <laugh>, but Batman won't. Batman won't admit.
Speaker 3 00:55:53 Yeah. Even in Justice, the animated movie is like, bro, I'm the smartest man alive.
Speaker 1 00:55:59 Yeah. Yeah. So Mr. Terrific. I think he's a great, he's a great, great character. He, um,
Speaker 3 00:56:04 Yeah. And we already had him in live action. Yeah. And who was perfect.
Speaker 1 00:56:10 Yeah. I think of all these,
Speaker 3 00:56:12 What in Arrow?
Speaker 2 00:56:14 Uh,
Speaker 1 00:56:15 I think of all these, I'm, I'm most excited maybe for Anthony Kerrigan as Metamorpho. Did you guys see Barry?
Speaker 3 00:56:21 I seen Barry. I seen Gotham
Speaker 1 00:56:23 Who was right. No. Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. I, I I think because he can do, he can do medicine and who, who was also in the Flash. Yeah. And he can do silly. I think he, he's just a very versatile actor. And I think he is perfect for Metamorpho. I think. I think it'll be fantastic. Um, what do you think, how do you think Superman legacy will solve some of the problems that passed Superman adaptation? So Superman, it's been kind of difficult to nail it. Snyder really struggled. Um, yeah, Smallville had some trouble with it. I think Superman and Lois has done it perfectly, but what do you think Superman legacy can do to make the Superman that everyone can love?
Speaker 2 00:57:01 Well, let's start off with the thing you said there at the end. You said Superman. Lois is a good one. Why is that? Because he's passed his prime. We've already gotten past the origin stories. Mm-hmm. <affirmative>, I think people are getting fed up with that. Think back to Man of Steel. What was it? An 18 minute opener spent on Crypto 15. That could have been Con 15. Okay. The point is that was like 10 minutes, way too long. I'm sure that general audiences walking in and we're confused as hell. That's exactly what we're seeing and why this was taking Stone. You have to consider, we think of this as, as Aficionados fans, we're really dialed into this stuff. But for the people that are like, I see Superman, I want to go see Superman. And you walk in and when you spend time with that, it's like a little frustrating.
Speaker 2 00:57:40 So I think Legacy right off the bat, is gonna have the advantage of, we're not spending time getting to know who or what he is. We just meet him and then we go. So they have a strong starting point because they're also rebooting the universe, sort of, I have opinions on that, but nothing too strong. I'm, I'm not gonna get into it. It's just I hope that the main thing they do is focus on streamlining it so that they understand what is and what isn't connected together. Because while I'm excited to see him have his movie, I'm equally excited to see him pop up in other stuff later down the road. I mean, think about some of these other projects. Superman has to show up. He has to, yeah. He, he's gonna be important if we're starting the D C U with him, I need to see him still show up throughout.
Speaker 2 00:58:30 And, um, with the castings that they already have announced, they're good ages so they can work with them for a while. Like as much, I, I understand your respect and love for Caval, but I mean, he's already aged out of the role in my, in my opinion. But now with David, they're in a great position where they could spend 10, 15 years just like they did with R D J as as Ironman. I mean, we got 15 good years. It was, or what, 11, 12. Still we got over a decade with one person with multiple, you know, we had the whole adventures. So I want to see them do that here and make him the iconic Superman. Like Caval. Yeah, it clicked a couple times. But with those weird release windows that had huge gaps between 'em, it was hard to stay in with that. With the way they have D C U structured, at least it looks like there's gonna be stuff down the pipeline so that you're thinking about it. That's where, where Marvel does really well is there's constantly something at some point. And, and I, I could see them with how strongly they're investing into this, that they're gonna do something similar. And they have a platform, they have a streaming platform now. So
Speaker 1 00:59:43 Vic, what are you looking forward to in Legacy?
Speaker 3 00:59:46 Hmm. I really want to see something that won't be as easy in interpreting as in previous projects. 'cause I love Schneider version because it, you, you had to think, you had to think what you see. You had to process it. You had to analyze some things. And I don't know, some people say it was for the bad, it was for the worse. And I think it was for the better. Because some, in this case, you had a serious Superman project where you really had to watch that you really had to watch a few times and then only once to understand. And I really want for Superman legacy to be something in between. Then you can go and watch it and you like it. And when you watch it again, you, you have, you have this feeling like, oh wow, I didn't see this before. Oh my God, it's so amazing. And I love it. And I don't want it to be another Superman project, like Superman from Superman in, uh, from, you know, the 40 years ago with Christopher Res or Superman returns, or even Superman and Lloyds. I want it to be on its own thing. Like, you create something new, so let it be something new and not adapt all those previous things. And
Speaker 1 01:01:11 I think what James Gun did really well in his Guardian trilogy, you like, there's one level where it's so entertaining, there's another level where it's so emotional. Yes. And there's a lot to think about. And so I, I think Legacy, hopefully will connect that to exactly what you're saying. Yeah.
Speaker 2 01:01:25 That's the thing I felt with Benice Steel and, and Bammy versus Superman and Snyder. Like, I felt like the only emotion he had was brooding. And I wanna see Ba or I wanna see Superman experience more than one. So
Speaker 3 01:01:37 Yeah. Because
Speaker 2 01:01:38 A gun.
Speaker 3 01:01:39 Yeah. Because in, uh, in Steiner's version, he was sad and angry. Mm-hmm. <affirmative> and all that. Mm-hmm. <affirmative> sometimes happy. He, he was smiling. Okay. But
Speaker 2 01:01:48 I know, yeah. I I I know, but I'm just saying like, it felt like 80% of the time it was just one emotion. Yeah,
Speaker 3 01:01:54 Exactly. And in previous projects it was 90, 18, 90%. Oh, he was happy all the time and didn't even consider some serious things. And I want to be the perfect balance between those two. And I had the talk with my friends like, uh, two days ago. And we think that it's the best, uh, exit point to all the castings that will happen in the future. Like the next projects, the next project to start the casting calls is Batman. And I think they need to, you know, to put current Sweat and the candidate for Batman together, but they have to be the similar height. Like, okay. So I think Current Sweat has,
Speaker 2 01:02:44 I believe it's 6 2, 6 3,
Speaker 1 01:02:46 I wanna say.
Speaker 2 01:02:47 Yeah. He's, he's a little bit taller than me.
Speaker 3 01:02:48 He's, he's my height.
Speaker 2 01:02:50 What is it?
Speaker 3 01:02:51 Uh, one meter, 92 centimeters. 93. So six
Speaker 2 01:02:54 Three. Damn.
Speaker 3 01:02:56 Yeah. So we thought that John Knuckles will be, would be the best Batman because we, we want to see, we are about to see the, the older Batman as a son and Ackles is about the same height. So you can have, you know, the similar Superman, Batman, you can have the Superman who's big and Batman, who's small. Like what would it be? So yeah, so I think that Superman legacy, it will not only be the, one of the best projects to start building the universe, but also one of the best projects to, you know, to, to pick actors in the other projects. Yeah.
Speaker 1 01:03:33 So one thing to mention real quick, uh, David Corns sweat is 30 years old. Yeah. Yeah. And Jensen Ackles is 45.
Speaker 3 01:03:40 Yeah, that's perfect. Perfect for me.
Speaker 1 01:03:42 And this universe. Do you think Batman will be that much older?
Speaker 3 01:03:45 Yeah, I think Superman will be 25, 26. Okay. And Batman? Batman will be, Batman
Speaker 2 01:03:50 Will be late thirties, forties,
Speaker 3 01:03:52 And Batman will be in his early forties. Early forties. Yeah. 'cause because when Damien is 14, 14 years old, and when he hooks up with, uh, with Talia, he's ar he's in his mid twenties. So yeah. So that would make sense for me and just like as looks young, so Yeah.
Speaker 2 01:04:12 Uh, VIN, you asked something earlier and I wanna go back to it. You were asking what things you want to see incorporated. The one thing I really do want to see, like just it came to mind was, I wanna see Team Up. I wanna see Superman with other heroes. Yeah. And in this, it seems like this movie, we're gonna get it. I mean, you have I hope so. Talk Girl. And yeah, so that's one thing I just wanna see. I wanna see Team Up. I like seeing super, like solo's great. And it's, it's awesome, but sometimes I want to see the man work with other people.
Speaker 3 01:04:36 Yeah. But don't they make the movie about Superman and heroes? Like
Speaker 2 01:04:40 Correct. Correct.
Speaker 3 01:04:42 Just use them as background or something. Or just showing different point of view or just,
Speaker 2 01:04:48 I wanna say Batman versus Superman did well with Wonder Woman. Yeah. They had her show up later on. They didn't ever thing it out the whole damn time she showed up when it really got heated. That works.
Speaker 3 01:04:56 Exactly. Or just as in animated Flashpoint Paradox, where at the beginning you have 15, 20 minutes, or even in the Flash, uh, the live action flash, you have 15, first 15, 20 minutes with Team Up Heroes and the rest is about, and the rest is about, uh, Superman Flash or whoever you want Journey. So, so yeah.
Speaker 1 01:05:16 Yeah, yeah. Um, related to what we were talking about before and the power of having John Kent, the son of Superman, um, since we're getting Batman with Damien, should we have, should Superman have that son and this D C U will we see the son in Legacy
Speaker 2 01:05:30 Towards David's exit? Sure, why not? Or maybe halfway through when he knows he is gonna wrap up and he is. I'm done. That'd be a great idea. You know, but let me enjoy Pal first. Please. You know, like I need to spend some time with him. I do wanna see John and everything, but like, give me like, well we got ca for three movies, four, if you wanna cl Count Black Adam. And that doesn't even really count anymore. But like, I really need to spend a little bit more time with him. I need to see him face a couple more villains and go through a couple storylines and meet several people. Like, I'd hate for it to be like, yeah, okay, here's Superman. He is got a son on the way. Like, I, I know it works for the Brave and the Bold because that story's been written and there's so much there ready to go for it. And that mantle's different, but like, I really need to see, does this mean,
Speaker 1 01:06:18 Does this mean Damien is gonna be much older than John, rather
Speaker 2 01:06:23 Probably be older than
Speaker 1 01:06:23 Superboy?
Speaker 2 01:06:24 Yeah, probably. That's what I'm saying. Which would be good, because then he could tell him like, Hey, our dad's work together. I've experienced, like, you have superpowers. It took me a few years to take Master combat, master Gadgets, master knowing how to fight these people, knowing they layout, getting the equipment being taught by my dad, blah, blah, blah. Yeah. It's a little different when all you have to do is just wake up and you're strong as hell and you can punch a hole through the side of a steel tank. Like, you don't really need to train that much. Versus like what Batman does, he rigorously put his body through everything. So Damien's gonna have to do the damn same damn thing. Yeah.
Speaker 3 01:07:02 And Luke, you have already, let's say, developed Batman and Sperm who's starting, and you have Clark and Bruce Wayne, and then you'll have Damien who's like 30 years old, and John, who's turned 18 and his father just stopped being Superman. It is up to him. So like you have, you have this circle where have mm-hmm. You know, the egg and the bird and all that. And I really love it. So yeah. So yeah, but I think that, I mentioned it in my article, the comic book review, uh, that perfect way to introduce John is in the Team Up Justice League movie at the end of book two with time travel technology. And only by that.
Speaker 1 01:07:47 That makes sense. I think especially if it, if it's the time travel, he's coming back from the future, I think that could work and it could even make them similar agents. Um, one last very, very important question for you all. Red undies. Yes or no?
Speaker 2 01:08:00 No, no
Speaker 1 01:08:02 Kidding. You guys just watch my adventures with Superman and I hate it.
Speaker 2 01:08:06 I don't need them. I, they're cool if they have them. Cool. You know, I'm not, I'm, I'm never married to anything as far as costumes, unless it's something you absolutely need. Like, I don't know, Deadpool without a gun is weird, but like, Superman without Undies is not that weird.
Speaker 1 01:08:21 I don't know, man. Like, look, Superman and Lois No Undies. I love the show. It's fine. It's great. It's great. It's great. Well then, but My ventures with Superman and now I love that explanation. Well
Speaker 2 01:08:31 Animated. It looks cool. It looks cool. It's just live action. When does it really come off that It looks good. It just doesn't. Okay. And you're gonna have a name or situation where you're gonna have to see G i out the Bulge.
Speaker 1 01:08:40 Okay. I see what you're saying.
Speaker 2 01:08:42 That's what I'm saying. Like, it's, it's a little Yeah. Because it's such a weird area. Yeah. You know, if they were like shorts, not briefs that come up and just accentuate that little v spot, it wouldn't be so weird.
Speaker 1 01:08:53 I really like the animated series when it's actually, it looks black with like little red highlights. I, I think that could work. Maybe, but I don't know it, it's not a deal breaker. But I think James Gunn could do it if anyone's gonna do it. I think James Gunn could.
Speaker 3 01:09:07 Yeah. I mean,
Speaker 2 01:09:08 I think he can do it for sure. Just look
Speaker 3 01:09:09 At this, it looks bad.
Speaker 2 01:09:12 Um, I think the last thing we were gonna talk about was shooting, but with the strike happening, we can't.
Speaker 3 01:09:17 Yeah.
Speaker 2 01:09:18 Yeah. I mean, that's so indefinite. So
Speaker 3 01:09:21 Yeah, everything can happen.
Speaker 2 01:09:23 Yeah. No, I just, Superman's great. I'm excited for Superman legacy and, and hopefully James Gun listens to me and tells commission someone to make a amazing Superman game for me to play one day.
Speaker 1 01:09:36 But right now we're just, we're so lucky. There's so much good Superman stuff. Superman and Lois, my adventures with Superman legacy coming out. It's a great, great time to be a Superman. Thank you everyone for listening. This has been the Cosmic Circle talking Superman. I'm Vin. You can find me on Twitter and Blue Sky at vin writes words. Uh, guys, where can we find you?
Speaker 2 01:09:56 You can find me at rodo on Twitter.
Speaker 3 01:09:59 Uh, you can find me at alki on Twitter and stay tuned 'cause there are some good articles coming. Mm-hmm.
Speaker 1 01:10:06 <affirmative>. And of course, you can follow all of our
[email protected] and continue the conversation on Twitter at my Cosmic Circus and at Cosmic podcast, as well as our discord server, which is literally always active. Thanks for listening. See you next time. Bye.
Speaker 3 01:10:21 Bye.
