Speaker 0 00:00:00 <silence>
Speaker 2 00:00:17 Welcome back listeners to another episode of the Cosmic Circle, the official podcast of the Cosmic Circus, where we discuss everything nerdy under the cosmos. On today's episode, we'll be talking about secret invasions. That's right. Marvel Studios is back on Disney plus after a six month wait, and we are so excited to talk about it. My name is Brian Kitson, head writer at The Cosmic Circus, and joining me today are Alex Perez, Anthony Flagg and Uday Katara. How are we doing guys?
Speaker 1 00:00:46 They have me under an n d A that states, I can't speak for more than 30 seconds at a time, so good luck. <laugh>.
Speaker 2 00:00:53 The clock is tick. That was Alex Perez everybody.
Speaker 1 00:00:58 Hi everyone. I'm good. And
Speaker 2 00:00:59 I'm not on your
Speaker 1 00:01:00 Alex per <laugh>.
Speaker 3 00:01:02 This is Anthony and I'm good. I have nothing to say on this one.
Speaker 2 00:01:06 Well, then with that lovely intro, let's get started. So, like I said, Marvel Studios is back in Disney Plus, and not only that, Nick Fury has returned. Um, this is the first live action project that we've had with, uh, Nick Fury in a, in a starring role since Captain Marvel. I'm not counting, uh, the end of Infinity War, and I couldn't remember if it was an end game. So if if someone wants to fill me in with those, that's okay. Um, but what do we think of his return? He was, and I'm, he was an endgame <laugh>,
Speaker 1 00:01:37 He was an endgame at the end, at the funeral when like the shot of like everyone on the file at the cabin and then all of a sudden he's like the last person at the cabin
Speaker 2 00:01:46 And he was standing behind Carol. So it's cute that, you know, they're still friends. Aw, there we go. Full circle moment. So he's back and he's on our screens. So what do we think of his return? And Alex, I'm gonna start with you. I got the clock started.
Speaker 1 00:02:00 Oh, <laugh> great to put me on the spot. Uh, you know, I I I thought it was great. I, I know that this story really is just about putting Nick Fury in, essentially like Nick Fury trying to come to terms with the fact that the world isn't what it used to be, and at the same time trying to take, uh, trying to handle the effects of the blip. 'cause all of these shows after, after end game have really all just been about how everyone has handled the blip in different parts of, of their universe. So, so yeah, that's kind of cool.
Speaker 2 00:02:39 Okay. Rudy, what about you? What are you thinking? How are you feeling about Nick Fury's return the class also on for you? 'cause I know that maybe you had some strong feelings about this show. I do. Um, I gotta be honest, I'm not feeling it. Like, I do like the concept that Nick Fury isn't, you know, three steps ahead, like he always is.
Speaker 4 00:02:58 I, I just don't really feel anything because the last time that we saw Nick Fury Do Something for Real was in Age of Ultron. And so we don't even know what anything of what he was doing between like 2015 and 2018 in the M C U. And so then now to be thrown into him post Blip, I'm just kind of like, I didn't even get to see you pre blip. So it's just, it just feels off to me and it's not really engaging me.
Speaker 2 00:03:25 Alright. And Anthony Flagg. Hey buddy. How you doing? Hey, it's been a while since I've seen you on here, you and I
Speaker 3 00:03:30 Together. Yeah, I know. It's always good when we link up. Um, as far as Nick Fury returning, I'm glad we're getting him for a little bit before he shows up in the Marvels, um, since he's kind of been missing for a bit. So yeah, I guess this is a good primer until we get to that movie towards the end of the year. That's about all I got.
Speaker 2 00:03:49 Yeah, this is the year of Nick Fury. I'm so excited. Uh, anything you wanna put Samuel Jackson in? I'm down for, especially when it's Margo related. So I'm excited that we have this back. This is also one of my most anticipated projects so far. And from what I know, it's gonna probably stay that way. I'm not gonna say much. I'm not gonna pull an Alex Perez in this podcast. Um,
Speaker 1 00:04:11 Why, why you gotta throw me under the bus <laugh>.
Speaker 2 00:04:14 It's all, it's all because we
Speaker 1 00:04:15 Love you. I agree. I know. And I, and there was a, a line <inaudible> said earlier, which is like, uh, about, uh, we don't know what he's been up to since like 2015. Reminder for people that don't remember, uh, Nick Fury has been off world since 2014, I believe when the Winter Soldier came out because at the end of Winter Soldier, that's when we know that he switched with Telos to become like scroll and whatnot. But, uh, I know for a fact that that question's going to be answered because they're gonna fill in the gaps of what Nick Fury has been up to, not just on that point, but essentially every point that he's been active. So between, for example, between Captain Marvel and Ironman, between the Ironman events and the Avengers after the Avengers, all of that. And they're, and it's gonna start next episode from what I understand. So it's gonna be cool.
Speaker 2 00:05:15 Okay. I, that means that we're getting some answers really quickly. Um, and I can't wait to hear those. So about this first episode Yes. Um, what did we like about it and Uday? 'cause I know your list is maybe a little bit longer what you didn't like. I wanna start with you and tell me, tell me what you liked about this. Give me the positives.
Speaker 4 00:05:34 I do like the street level corner of the M C u the best pre um, pre phase four, I was always very much cosmic. I didn't really care that much about street level spy stuff. I just wanted the space stuff. And that's really changed recently. 'cause I feel like the street level spy stuff in phase four was like the best of the phase and the magic of course. 'cause I'm still a wand to stand. Um, but I do like going back to these characters, you know, I like having Nick Fury and Maria Hill and now Telo is kind of in the crew. Um, this is like everything that I wanted from a Marvel project. I'm just not really loving the execution so far. But I guess, yeah, the smaller scale of it is definitely my favorite part.
Speaker 2 00:06:15 Before we move on real quick, listeners, I'm sorry for, to do this earlier, spoiler warning, in case we get into something that's gonna be spoilers. So, um, Anthony, what did you like about this project? I mean, the first episode
Speaker 3 00:06:28 Specifically first episode, uh, there was actually a few things. Uh, one I liked that they introduced a bunch of characters right from the get go. You got Sonya, GRA and Gaia, just all in all in one. You got to meet them. Mm-hmm. <affirmative>. I really hate how M C U sometimes takes a while to introduce your villain, two thirds away in the show or whatever. We just know from the get go. And then the other thing I really enjoyed was seeing all the little spy things, like the little contact thing that, uh, Nick Fury was using and how they were chasing. You know, I'm, I like James Bond movies a lot, so he just felt like James Bond movie condensed into a hour and you know, the someone dies of course. And it just happened to be Maria. So for, for the spy action direction they were shooting for, they did pretty well. So I enjoyed that.
Speaker 2 00:07:18 You know, growing up I always wanted to be a spy. I had way too much spy stuff in my house. I so like, this is feeding that like nostalgic you wanting to, to grow up to be a spy. Um, as for the villain, I think it's very interesting that I think this is maybe one of our most sympathetic villains we've had. Because you look at him and while he is doing bad things, he maybe isn't, doesn't feel so bad when you think about how angry people get when they've lost everything. And so, as a psychologist that I, that really stuck out to me, um, off of what you just said, Anthony,
Speaker 3 00:07:51 Alex being abandoned and forgotten too, because graphic made it a point. Oh that's like, well y'all were kind of, y'all came back after the snap, but then kind of forgot about us again. So Right.
Speaker 2 00:08:02 Abandonment issues 1 0 1. Alex, what did you like about it?
Speaker 1 00:08:07 I, I'm probably in the minority of the people that actually liked how secret invasion's playing out. The thing is, I'm a little bit biased because I grew up with the comic. So regardless of what it is to me, scrolls were always like my favorite villains growing up. 'cause that was like the first comic series I read completely. And then I read Civil War because it was the one that came like before and all that stuff in dark rain, blah, blah, blah. But, um, the, to me, what I like most is that the show feels very high stakes here. Because immediately from the get go, you already have the, this idea that Everett Ross is not who he is, is a scroll. And then by the end, you literally kill off one of the first characters from phase one. You kill Maria Hill off the bat in the first episode when people thought she was gonna be in this longer.
Speaker 1 00:09:06 And that shows you this show will change the face of the M C U because of the high stakes it's presenting. And I know that a lot of people are like, oh, but it's not, you know, like, oh, they just killed her off the bat. What are they doing? And people hate it and, and whatnot. But I, I feel like the, the point with Maria Hill was to make people realize anyone can die at any moment in this series. Any person can not be who they say they are. They'll probably, they're probably a scroll and people will not know. And that's what I love the most about this series, is the fact that you cannot trust anyone. Not you can't believe your own eyes when watching this show.
Speaker 2 00:09:47 So off of that, then I have a question for you, Alex, because I also read the series, though I didn't read it until I was an adult. It's one of my favorites. Mm-hmm. <affirmative> growing up with this story and then learning that the director was, you know, the director or the writer, correct me if I'm wrong, one of them was told that they were not supposed to read the comic when they were developing the series. I
Speaker 1 00:10:07 Believe it was the director. I believe it was. I know what you're, I know what you're referring to though.
Speaker 2 00:10:12 Like, how does that make you feel though? Because like, this is one of your favorites and all of a sudden there's no, you know, they told them not to look at the source material.
Speaker 1 00:10:22 The thing is, if you look at the source material, you're not gonna get an exact thing because I know that a lot of people looked at secret invasion and this is nowhere near this massive 'cause. The point of secret invasion is that half of the Marvel Universe is a scroll. Not only that, but like the, the people that are involved in, in the secret invasion storyline, just quick summary. Half of these heroes go to the Savage Land and they face off against like their former selves. And no one knows who's who. And then you have this incredibly massive battle in the middle of New York with Superpowered Scrolls and like their hero counterparts. And there is no way that they were gonna make that into a series, you know? Mm-hmm. <affirmative> so on in a part, I understand why they didn't want them to read the series, but in another part I find it difficult to believe because there has, like, because they're there basically inserting the number one premise of secret invasion, which was that the secret invasion in and of itself was scrolls inserting themselves in positions of power across the globe.
Speaker 1 00:11:38 And I'm talking, you know, there was a, there's a panel where like the scrolls announced that they're invading earth after revealing that they've been there for years living amongst them. And it was just to screen with like Tony Stark and Magneto, Dr. Doom, Barack Obama, uh, Oprah, Stephen Colbert, I remember the panel by heart. And it had all of these influential people from media, people from the comics presenting themselves as though like, Hey, we've been living amongst you in these incredibly power in these huge positions of power. Like hell the Pope, it was the pope was a scroll, you know? And that's what they're doing here. And I find it hard to believe that. Like, I know people are like, oh, but he didn't read the comic. I'm like, that doesn't matter. 'cause he's still applying the v the very basic premise, which is that scrolls invaded earth and have taken over in positions of power and have been doing so for years. And when I'm talking years, I'm talking fricking phase one, right? Since phase one, there was already a scroll in in power and people don't know it yet. And I'm not gonna spoil who it's <laugh>.
Speaker 2 00:12:48 So let me ask you this then. Uday, uh, Anthony, how do you feel about maybe them not having these people that are making this series read the comic series? Does that feel kind of an odd choice?
Speaker 4 00:13:03 I'm just gonna say if episode one opened with Oprah Winfrey becoming a scroll instead of Everett Ross, this, this show would've gotten immediate 10 outta 10 from me. Um, honestly, I'm gonna say something very controversial. I have never read a comic book in my life that is not an Archie comic. So I don't really care that much about comic accuracy. Like, I, I mean, I'm not a Marvel comics fan. I'm an M C U fan. And I do think it's weird that they told the director to like, disregard the comic series. I don't really agree with that. I think you're adapting the source material. You should know the source material. And as a Percy Jackson fan, I know what happens when you don't read the source material when you started happening. Let's
Speaker 1 00:13:45 Not talk about those movies, but let's not talk about those movies. Let's not talk about that
Speaker 4 00:13:50 <laugh>. So I think it's odd, but then I do agree with what Alex said that, I mean, they are just taking the base concept of it and, and they're applying it to a completely different thing. Like the m c secret invasion is nothing like the comic event, apart from the fact that people are scrolls, uh, as Alex said, like people in positions of power. So I don't think it's the biggest deal, but I also don't think that they should have encouraged him avoiding the comic.
Speaker 1 00:14:17 There's also, I I wanna jump in really quick because there's a, there's layers to this layers about like, uh, about how this process works in terms of writing, in terms of, uh, in terms of how these stories go. And the main reason why they ask these people not to read the source material is because Marvel's own team, like already knows what they wanna adapt from that story. Like there are people that, dozens of people who will dedicate their time and their lives to write essentially what is the entire timeline of not just the project, but essentially the entire phase. And they, and in order for it to be cohesive, they're like, okay, so we're gonna take, we're gonna take this as source material and we're gonna take this from source material. But at the same time, they wanna tell their own story. They don't wanna retell a story from the comics because it's not going to fit into what they want to present to an audience. Uh, and it's not gonna fit into their overall story, which is why normally they'll, like, there's a screenwriter and there's, there's a script writer, but there's also people involved within Marvel's old team own team that's gonna be like, all right, so here's some notes we wanna apply this, don't do this and, and all that sort of stuff.
Speaker 2 00:15:36 I mean, that's fair. I mean I think that it's interesting that they specifically told them not to. I think that like familiarity is both a good and a bad thing because if you're too familiar with it, then you're just adapting one for one and then it doesn't get to be its own thing. But, um, okay. Sorry for that. Quick aside, Anthony, I wanna start with this question for you. So while we seem to like parts of this series or this episode, um, what didn't you like about it? Is there anything that stuck out to you about this first episode that you just feel didn't work?
Speaker 3 00:16:09 It's funny 'cause I'm getting deja vu to another time. And that's when we made, I think the book of Boba Fit, where we didn't get any sort of recap leading into this show, which you don't need it. You can watch legends sure if you want, but like walking into this show, you're like, well, whoa, there's this connectedness, like what happened beforehand? And I understand you don't get 'em for all, obviously not Moonlight or Miss Marvel 'cause it was introduction, but like, we know Fury would've been nice to have something in advance knowing what we're going into. And um, guy, uh, I know it's weird to say I have nothing against her. I just, I'm just so confused with her alliances and everything. Like her hesitation towards her dad kind of felt weird when she was running away with the bombs. So, uh, that's about it.
Speaker 2 00:17:00 I have so much to say about her. Uh, a few questions down that I'm gonna hold off, but I a hundred percent agree that they need, they need to recap. I feel like video games need to do this too, where it's like you haven't played in like three months. So like, catch me up again, tell me what the controls are, tell me what happened in the story so I could jump back in. Because it's like feeling a little bit like you lose your memory. Um, Uday what didn't you like about this?
Speaker 4 00:17:24 So I feel like there was a lot of telling and not showing, which is a big problem of mine with like, like some things in Marvel. It's just so much telling and not enough showing. And I know that Alex said that we'll kind of learn what Fury's been up to later and that's great, but I thought that this was a very weak start for the series because again, we're just like told that in the 30 years since Captain Marvel like Carol and Fury didn't find them at home. First of all, that seems really weird. I do think it makes graphic very sympathetic, but I also think it's really strange that like Carol seems to have done nothing in the last 30 years. Like she didn't stop the Cree scroll war or did she, I can't tell if it's Sohan in the Marvels. She didn't find the squirrels at home.
Speaker 4 00:18:09 She wasn't at home with her family like Maria and Monica. So I feel like it's just making the Captain Marvel corner of the universe a little bit, even more convoluted than it already was. I feel like we really needed a flashback to show what fury or telos or both of them have been up to. And again, and like my problem is that it just feels really disengaging. Like I love all of these characters, but I'm not really feeling anything for them in this show because it's been so long since they've done anything of note. Both Hill and Fury haven't actually been in an M C U movie with a speaking part and not being an alien since 2015. And or I mean, well, fury flashback in Captain Marvel of course, but I just think it's, I think it's really strange how disconnected and disengaging everything feels when it's characters that we've known and loved for so long.
Speaker 4 00:18:59 And I even felt that in the opening, like, I don't care that Ross is a scroll, he was acting super shifty. So it was immediately obvious. And then also like, when was he replaced? Like that scroll was not acting like the Ross we know at all. So was he replaced after Wakanda forever? And if he was replaced after Wakanda forever, why do I care that a random scroll took the face of Martin Freeman for like a two minute opening? Like it's, it's not shocking, it's not destabilizing, it's not like, oh my God, anyone could be a scroll. So I don't know, it's just for, for me it's, it's just not really connecting yet, but I'm hoping that it's gonna get really like a lot better in the middle and towards the end because the writing is so sloppy at the beginning. I hope they're rushing the beginning to get to something really, really good by the end.
Speaker 2 00:19:45 I, I will say this, that when I watched Wana forever in theaters, it stuck out to me instantaneously that he didn't react enough around his ex-wife for him to be the real him. And it stuck out to me in that moment, so much so. But then again, I'm a, I'm a couple's counselor for most of my days, so like getting to see the, the heatedness between families of divorced kids, you know, it just didn't seem right to begin with. Um, so I think that it was before Wakanda forever, but I could be completely wrong. Um,
Speaker 1 00:20:17 I wanna, but that makes
Speaker 3 00:20:18 Me wonder if Val would've noticed, she would've noticed one. Be familiar with Scrolls, right? I don't know. Sorry guys,
Speaker 1 00:20:24 I wanna elaborate. That's all right. I wanna elaborate. 'cause literally we're talking about two things which literally correlate to each other, which is going back to Brian's original question, but what I didn't like about this show, I don't like how fast paced it was at the beginning. Like it opens with Ross answering a phone call in the middle of nowhere. Like, why is Ross here? You know, why, why was Ross here? What was the point of bringing Ross to the middle of Russia when the last time we saw him, he was like, saved by fricking uh, ko. And I'm like, how did he get here? And the thing is, I know that they're, they filmed more stuff with him and it's hard for me to understand why it started here out of all things. And I don't think they're, the thing is, I don't think they're gonna even show how he got there to begin with because it's a scroll.
Speaker 1 00:21:20 But to kind of answer the question about like Ross being a scroll or not, uh, Ross being a scroll in secret invasion was probably one of the oldest leaks I've ever had that I've tried to keep secret to myself. But Brian knows about this. I feel like we've known, we've known this for even before Wakanda forever, we kind of knew that Ross was gonna be a scroll. And, and I was trying to pinpoint at what point he ki he was kind of switched because we've had very few moments with him on screen. You know, there was Civil War, then there was Black Panther, then there was Wakanda forever. And you know, now there's, now there's this. But, um, you know, the one thing that I would consider that kind of like, to me it had to be at some point before Wakanda forever, because I mentioned this on Twitter and I got a lot of heat for it because I, I phrased it wrong because, uh, and I didn't mean to say it like that.
Speaker 1 00:22:24 So if any, if any women are listening or ex Yves are listening, well, I didn't mean by by that comment, but what I meant to say was that he was just indifferent when Val showed up. Like he didn't, like Brian said he was indifferent, you know, and like there's a thing with like being a business relationship, but if you, like, if you don't know, first and foremost, he didn't know that Val was gonna show up on the bridge. And when she, when he, when she shows up, he's just like, oh. Uh, and he keeps saying, director di Fontaine, he doesn't say Val, he keeps saying Director di Fontaine. It's like he, like, she even got like uncomfortable by him saying that. And there was, and there's even moments like when he's about to be arrested, he's like, not like if you're trying to escape being arrested, you would like make a point of like, oh, uh, you know, uh, I'm trying to appeal to their nature, you know, not be like the Wakanda saved my life. You know? And it's, it was weird 'cause like his, his acting in Wakanda forever was not as natural to me as if, as if it would've been in like Black Panther civil war. Maybe I'm overlooking into it, but I, for me, it had to be, he had to be a scroll before Waka forever just 'cause it was way different in his, in his mannerisms.
Speaker 4 00:23:50 So honestly, I think that's really interesting because I didn't think anything of his relationship with Val in Wakanda forever. And I've, and I've seen Wakanda forever a lot. But to me, like <laugh> him calling her director, it's like, it, it's kind of that over formality because you used to have a very personal relationship, but now you have a business relationship. So I'm not reading into it 'cause like I think he's a scroll. But then the other thing is I feel like we're overestimating more visibility sometimes because I think about how Kobe Smolders didn't even know that she was a scroll throughout all afar from home. And so I'm like, did they really tell Martin Freeman, Hey, you're gonna be a scroll in secret invasion for like two minutes, so be sure to act like a little bit weird in Wakanda forever. Um, I don't know. No, no,
Speaker 1 00:24:38 Absolutely not. Absolutely not. They didn't tell him at all. He, they, he literally was just like, nah, that, but I'm pretty sure that, I don't know, the wording to me was weird. It was just like the way it was, it was done, it was very awkward, you know? Yeah. It was awkward. And now there's like this new technology, right, where scrolls normally couldn't sim recent memories. Now they have to go in even deeper and they're like showing like, oh, well hijack their memories and now we can now know now they can be differentiated. And I'm like, that kind of sucks. 'cause like the original concepts like, oh, they can't really see eye to eye because of their memories. So I don't know how long this invasion's been going on and this like inhabiting stuff. So again, I could be wrong, but I just, I don't know.
Speaker 1 00:25:29 'cause it, it would seem weird to replace Agent Ross when he's a wanted fugitive and be like, you know what? I'm going to pretend to a scroll come in and be like, I'm going to pretend to be a c i a agent. Like, I will say this, I know where he is because if he, if he showed up and if he showed up in secret invasion and he's a scroll, I'm pretty sure I know where he is in, in the show and he might be brought back. But, uh, but I don't know how much I can say about that. So we're just gonna leave it there. Hopefully they'll answer the question, you know, of how long he's been a scroll, but, but I don't know how to answer that without it being a theory. So,
Speaker 4 00:26:12 Okay. The last thing I wanna say about Ross really quick is just after the first episode, I'm worried that the show is just too focused on who is a scroll and like, not going any deeper than that. 'cause for me it's not, is Ross a, is Ross a scroll? It's like, why do I care that Ross is a scroll, like Alex said, if he's just in the middle of Russia, which doesn't really line up with where we left him in Wakanda forever, and then he just dies and is a scroll. Like, why do I care? Like, I would care if say he didn't help them in Wakanda forever, and then at the end of Wakanda forever it was revealed that he was a scroll because that would like impact the other characters that we know and love. But a character like Ross on his own hasn't got enough time. Like, hasn't had enough screen time for me to be like, oh no, he's a scroll. Like, oh my, my favorite agent. Like, what am I gonna do now? You know? So I just, I thought that that reveal
Speaker 1 00:27:08 Was really weird space. I loved it. I know, I, I loved, I loved your reaction. 'cause that's literally the exact same thing I said. The one thing I thought was like, oh, they're gonna adapt this part from the comic where scrolls don't remember. Because that's the thing, the scroll, there were scrolls in the comics in secret invasion that inhabited their humans so, so well that they forgot they were scrolls and that they were so, so good at being sleep agents that they thought they were human until it was revealed to them. And they had an incredibly long crisis to the point where some of them killed all, some of them died because of the crisis they were having. So I thought that was the point with Ross and with some of these, but apparently the show at the fir at the beginning just says, no, they, they all know. And I'm just like, well, damn, they, they kind of lost an opportunity there. But, all right.
Speaker 2 00:27:59 But also think about it this way too. It would be very interesting to have the only agent that maybe is still on the side of the Wakandans now after everything that happened, turn out that he's been a scroll this whole time and doesn't remember, nor does he have an affiliation with the Wakandans and nobody's backing them anymore from the US government. That would
Speaker 4 00:28:19 Be, but Ross isn't, he's not backing them anymore anyway because he got arrested for treason. So they already don't have anyone in the US government.
Speaker 1 00:28:26 Yeah, that's the thing they're gonna talk about. No, they don't. That's that's a, that's a topic for Captain America Ford attack. But we're not gonna get into that one now. <laugh>. Let's keep going. Okay.
Speaker 2 00:28:37 Back to secret invasions. Yes. Uh, there's a lot of new faces. I know Anthony, you mentioned a few of them. Which one is your favorite and why is it Sonya? Because Olivia Coleman
Speaker 3 00:28:48 Is, how did you know, how did you know
Speaker 2 00:28:50 Olivia Coleman is a goddess and she deserves to be in everything <laugh>?
Speaker 3 00:28:54 No, it's funny 'cause I know her from that Mic and Webb show from like 20 years ago. It was a comedy show and it's just so weird. Remember seeing her in that or no Peep show either way. A old comedy show from England. Mm-hmm. <affirmative>. And uh, it's so weird seeing her dos, like super serious stuff, but she's really good at it. And I knew she was gonna be an instant favorite. You know, anybody in the My six is always really cool, especially if it's a woman m from James Bond, you know? Mm-hmm. <affirmative>, uh, was always one of my favorite characters ever.
Speaker 1 00:29:26 Dame Judy Dench.
Speaker 3 00:29:27 Exactly.
Speaker 2 00:29:28 And the fact that, uh, you know, Olivia Coleman wanted so bad to be an M C U. I feel like she is selling this part so hard to make it work. Um, but it's funny that you said you started with, with the comedy show. 'cause I saw her first as an Alien Doctor Who? And then I saw her in Broad Church. Oh,
Speaker 1 00:29:46 That's, yeah.
Speaker 3 00:29:46 I've seen her in both. I saw her in both. Yeah. She was a a, a
Speaker 2 00:29:50 Prisoner 66
Speaker 3 00:29:52 Prisoner. 66. I'm not remember
Speaker 2 00:29:54 Smith's first episode. Oh,
Speaker 1 00:29:57 I remember. 'cause I remember I all, I remember from that episode where she was in, it was just like Matt Smith going, who? The man. And then her side, like her head talking to the side with this like, stern look like really bitch <laugh>.
Speaker 2 00:30:11 Yeah.
Speaker 1 00:30:12 But yeah, I agree with both of you. She's literally my favorite and, and I love her. And bless your heart and yes to everything Olivia Coleman does.
Speaker 2 00:30:22 How about you? Uj?
Speaker 4 00:30:24 I first saw her in The Crown, so I'm kind of like Queen Elizabeth. What the hell are you doing? <laugh>? <laugh>, <laugh>. 'cause she's kind of has, she has the same deliveries 'cause 'cause she's still, you know, doing her regular, she's British, right? So she's doing her regular British accent. But her voice is just so distinctive that I'm like, like literally like Queen Elizabeth. Like why are you here? Um, but yeah, I do really like her. I will say. So I didn't love being dropped into the middle of certain things with no explanation in secret invasion. But she's not one of those things because I feel like we can really feel the history she has with Fury. And so I'm totally okay just being dropped into like the middle of their like reunion. And then as the show goes on, like we'll find out more about their history.
Speaker 4 00:31:09 I'm really looking forward to that. I also, I really just love all the little spy stuff that's being built out, especially with characters like Sonya or Val who are kind of like fury's contemporaries. 'cause we never got to see any of them in like, phase one, right? Like Fury was the only guy running around in the shadows. And I think it's cool that now we've got Sonya and Val that have also been running around in the shadows. Um, and so I'm really excited to see what they do with her. I also am like widow to
Speaker 3 00:31:38 Run around in the shadows.
Speaker 4 00:31:40 Yeah, but I, sorry, I meant more Rachel Weis. Just like Rachel,
Speaker 1 00:31:42 Rachel Weiss
Speaker 4 00:31:43 <laugh>. I meant more as like high level where Yeah, like, like the leaders kind of that aren't doing the dirty work. But yes, I, I love Natasha as well, but the other character I'm determined to like is Gaia. 'cause I do like Amelia Clark, even though I don't really think I've seen her in anything. She just seems like a nice person. <laugh>, um, and <laugh>. And I liked TE's daughter, you know, in the brief scenes in Captain Marvel. So I'm not, again, I'm not really feeling her in the first episode, but I'm determined to like her. So I hope that it only goes uphill from here. You know,
Speaker 1 00:32:16 I know that Sonia is like in all six episodes, but that's 'cause of the, because Disney like, released some pictures and they said Sonia FALs worth in episode six. So I'm just happy that she's, she's making it all the way through and it's like, yes, give me all of the Olivia Goldman <laugh>.
Speaker 2 00:32:33 If she doesn't start, uh, the Bri the Britain Corpse, I'm gonna be mad. But, um, I also,
Speaker 1 00:32:40 Ike I would give me, just give me any reason to keep Oli Olivia Coleman in the M C U. Like, I, I need this woman in something more because she is, she would just nail everything. And you know, from the interview that she's like, really I to just be in the M C U for anything? And I'm just like, you know what? Give her more. I need her in more. I would, would you imagine her having like an M type role in, in the M C U with like a Captain Britain project that would be the most insane, like make a James Bond project based on Captain Bri with Sonya as the equivalent of them done? I just wrote part of the N C A for you
Speaker 4 00:33:24 <laugh>. And speaking of Captain Bri, like, she seems to have this rivalry with fury, right? Where they're trying to one up each other. So I'm wondering after he found Captain America in Ice, if she was like, damn, I gotta get me one of those. Yeah. Need a super soldier
Speaker 1 00:33:38 <laugh>.
Speaker 3 00:33:38 She, she had a midlife crisis too. I wonder what she got, you know, because he got the Avengers, like he said.
Speaker 2 00:33:44 Right? But I also liked Gaia and going back Anthony, to what you were saying about not feeling that scene in the, the stairwell, that is my favorite scene of the entire episode because no, she captured the emotions of hating your father, but still loving him so well that I, and just like the, the fact that she hesitated to grab me the next rung and I was just like, I'm done. This is it. Like she nailed that. And I see this day in and day out with children all the time in my, in my job. So like, the fact that she nailed that in just that one scene, I can't wait to see more of it. And the way that she came back to like then warn them that this is happening because she felt bad. But she still doesn't want to give up the fact that she still mad at him. Amelia Clark, you deserve
Speaker 1 00:34:33 A award. I, I, I wanna I wanna add that my favorite scene from the move from like this episode was when she, when like Taylor's tells her that her mom died and she was just having like this moment and she, she like, she was having that moment and she's like, she leaves him, he goes up the stairs and just kind of like takes a moment to just like sit down and like cry. But then at the same time she's like, she immediate, like she cries, lets it out and then just leaves. And I'm like, that is so accurate to someone who is going through like, the middle of a situation, especially in a high 10 situation like a robbery or like going through war and just like, you're there and you're like, you just learned that you lost someone you love mm-hmm. <affirmative> and you're just like, you have to take a time out, but you gotta keep going. Mm-hmm. <affirmative>. And like, and I love that I, I was like Dan, that she didn't really well with that.
Speaker 2 00:35:27 If you haven't seen her in last Christmas or me before you, that girl can sell anything. So I'm totally, or Game
Speaker 1 00:35:36 Of Thrones or Game of Thrones. Game of Thrones throne thing. Thing with Game of Thrones was like barely any emotion until, you know, the disastrous season. <laugh>. Talk about that. Um,
Speaker 2 00:35:49 Anyways, so let's talk about Maria Hill's death. This, this episode ended with the cliffhanger of cliffhangers where a scroll, Nick Fury shot her point blank and she bled out. Was this necessary and why did it hurt so much? Uday, what are your thoughts?
Speaker 4 00:36:10 I think it's interesting that you said it hurt so much because once again I was like, I feel bad that Maria Hill died. But it just feels more wasteful and disappointing than sad because she's been a cool supporting character. And I don't think the M C U has enough like small supporting characters that pop up in a bunch of projects. You know, like that agent guy that's in no Way Home and Miss Marvel. Those are the kinds of characters I feel like I've been missing in phases three and four. And Maria Hill was like the ultimate version of that character. Like, I would've loved if Maria Hill was in Civil War, but because again, it's been so long since we've seen her and then she just kind of gets to stand around being upset with Fury. She did get like a cool, a couple cool spy moments. Like I liked her chasing down Gaia, but again, it just, it feels like a waste.
Speaker 4 00:37:00 It feels like they could have done more with Maria Hill and Secret Invasion was like the perfect spotlight for a character like that. And instead they just kill her. And so I, I agree that it kind of raises the stakes I guess. But it's like they don't have anyone else that expendable left to kill. They killed like a Ross Scrawl, they killed Maria Hill. The only other character I could like see being killed is maybe telos to go for the jugular and like episode six. But other than that, it's like no one else could die. So like what stakes are we raising here? No one's even left to be revealed as a scroll besides like Fury, which would be repetitive or roadie, which I know is everyone's like most popular fan theory.
Speaker 2 00:37:42 Okay, Alex was it, what are your thoughts on Maria Hill's death?
Speaker 1 00:37:48 You can't ask me that question. <laugh>.
Speaker 2 00:37:50 Alright. Anthony
Speaker 1 00:37:54 <laugh>, you can't, certain questions I cannot answer without building into spoiler. So Anthony, you're gonna have to take over for me. But Anthony
Speaker 3 00:38:04 Man. Yeah, yeah, no, it, it felt like just the last minute ending to make everybody go wide-eyed at three in the morning more than actually like, hey, shit's going down. So
Speaker 2 00:38:19 Yeah,
Speaker 3 00:38:20 It really didn't even hit that strongly emotionally. I'm just like, oh damn, she's dead.
Speaker 2 00:38:26 I, I have to say that I knew about <laugh>, I knew about this for weeks now and I still was eating, like, eating my dinner and I was just like, my, my, my spoon drops. 'cause my nephew just like turned and looked at me and he was like, did you know about this? And I was like, listen, I can either confirm or deny. And he was so upset, <laugh>. But I think that the power of this was kind of speaking to what you said Uday, is that he's watched, he's power watched these in the last two years. You know, he's watched all of the Marvel movies and all the TV shows. So like for him it's like all happening now. It didn't come out in chunks as we were like
Speaker 3 00:39:02 When I met her 11 years ago in, in Avengers. Mm-hmm. <affirmative>, you know, it's like I've been watching Maria Hills for 10 years now.
Speaker 2 00:39:08 Right.
Speaker 3 00:39:09 And when she dies I didn't feel anything that's not good.
Speaker 2 00:39:13 Right. And like would've hurt more if like in civil War she was in it and she got stabbed, you know, like, and then you would've been like, oh shit. You know, like that would've hurt.
Speaker 4 00:39:21 Exactly. And honestly I think what bothers me about her death is that it feels exactly like another frig. Like her death doesn't like make us care emotionally about her. Mm-hmm. <affirmative> her death makes us care about Fury. Where it's like, oh no, fury lost another one of like the people he loved. And I'm like, that sucks for him. But it feels like they just fridged Maria Hill in the exact same way that they fridged uh, Natasha and Gamora. And so now I'm kind of like, congratulations Marvel, you've killed off three of like your four original women. If like, so the only one left is Pepper Pots. So I guess she's gonna get frigid in Armor Wars now to make Rodie cry.
Speaker 2 00:40:00 I mean the more it did come back, so like in, in a world with a multi,
Speaker 1 00:40:07 We'll see, I feel like like's really weird about this. No, no. Hold on. Going back to the whole like Natasha Gamora and Hill thing. Do you notice how they all died with the same camera shot, the overhead zoom out shot of their dead, dead blood? Like Marvel.
Speaker 4 00:40:24 Oh yeah, Marvel. This I can't wait, wait for the, I can't wait for the Twitter. Like Photoshop people I saw 'cause people at Photoshop, like Gamora and Natasha like lying there like with their like dead bodies, like at the bottom of bme. I can't wait for someone to add uh, Maria Hill to that, to that to
Speaker 3 00:40:40 BME as well.
Speaker 4 00:40:41 Yeah. 'cause they're totally gonna do that.
Speaker 1 00:40:44 Seriously. It's like the third time they do it in the exact same format too. It's like, damn, what was the point?
Speaker 4 00:40:52 At least this time she got shot and she didn't get like, pushed off a building. Right.
Speaker 2 00:40:55 <laugh>.
Speaker 1 00:40:56 Damn.
Speaker 2 00:40:57 Oof. That's true. Um, okay, so then looking forward to, um, I I think we're gonna start, we're gonna end the story part with a fun question. Who do we believe from the entire M C U is the scroll at extra points? If you can tell me when they were switched out. Like, I'm talking anywhere in the M C U. It does not have to be in the show. I wanna know your crazy fan theory and why. Who wants to go first? I, you're all looking a little starry-eyed here. <laugh>. Okay. Who They, go ahead.
Speaker 4 00:41:31 I, the problem is that there's again, like, like I said, there's not a lot of characters left to be scrolls with like two of the agents dead and then like Telos already being a scroll. Um, so
Speaker 1 00:41:43 Teos is a scroll. A hundred percent <laugh>.
Speaker 4 00:41:45 I was gonna say, what if Teos is another scroll? What if Teos is an evil scroll and the real Taleo scroll is back at the compound? Um, but no, I feel, feel
Speaker 3 00:41:54 Like scroll impersonate another scroll
Speaker 2 00:41:56 Scroll reception.
Speaker 3 00:41:59 That's all.
Speaker 1 00:42:00 They can turn into anything, man. Yeah, I can confirm you. I can tell you, I can confirm you with certainty. They can. That's the thing. And they do it too, so yes. Okay. They good to know they can turn into other scrolls.
Speaker 4 00:42:12 Um, but yeah, I, I know that like, Rodie being a s scroll is a popular fan theory that would make me sad. 'cause I do like Rodie. Um, but I think it would be really juicy if he had been a, a s scroll since like civil war. Like I feel like if Marvel did something like that, that would be like truly destabilizing. Um, but at the same time I feel like it would kind of ruin the previous movies. 'cause then it's like, oh, the roadie that bought an end game was just some random alien. So I don't know. Honestly, I've kind of lost my enthusiasm for the whole who's a scroll thing because I just, I feel like there's no one left to play the game with.
Speaker 2 00:42:46 You're I'm saying in the entire M C U you're telling me there's not one character in any of these
Speaker 4 00:42:52 Shows. Sorry, sorry, I forgot. I forgot it was the entire M C U. I thought it was just the, I thought it was just the show. So scratch that. No. Um, I need another minute. <laugh>. Okay.
Speaker 2 00:43:01 Okay. Right. Um, go. Anthony, do you have one?
Speaker 3 00:43:05 Do you have one? I have one kind of, but do you have one Brian or no?
Speaker 2 00:43:10 I was thinking would be very interesting is if you found out someone like Hawkeye, like someone that's like, been there and just like been like a champion this entire time ends up being like a super scroll se not super scroll, but like a super secret agent scroll. Just like hiding there. Like I think that would hurt really bad and I think I would be like almost pissed off. Um, or if you found out like some, someone like Daredevil, but I feel like at the same time his impact in the M C U hasn't really been there quite so long yet. So like I feel like that wouldn't have the impact. But like one of like the major six Thor, you know, like they would just feel like a fucking oops, sorry. Like a, like a gut punch to the, to the stomach <laugh>.
Speaker 4 00:43:53 I was just about to say that. I, I was like, I was just arriving at Hawkeye myself 'cause he's the perfect character where it's like, yeah, I would be angry and upset but not super angry and upset. So I feel like, like I don't, I don't feel like it would retroactively ruin movies if Hawkeye had been a scroll the whole time. Mm-hmm. <affirmative>. Um, so honestly, yeah, I would also go with Hawkeye.
Speaker 3 00:44:14 I have one finally. Well I have two. The second one not so much, but the first one. Pepper, pepper pots.
Speaker 2 00:44:21 Oh,
Speaker 3 00:44:21 That would really mess with things. If she's been a scroll for a long time because she's been around since phase one. And then my second one, but this is just a wild one, is, uh, Justin Hammer.
Speaker 2 00:44:33 Oh, okay.
Speaker 4 00:44:34 Wait off the pepper topic. Pepper had also come to me 'cause I just mentioned her. Um, but I feel like if if a scroll had replaced her when she and Tony were broken up,
Speaker 2 00:44:46 Oh that also means that her kid kid is a half scroll.
Speaker 4 00:44:50 Okay. That's too complicated then.
Speaker 1 00:44:53 <laugh>.
Speaker 2 00:44:55 Alex, do you have a crazy theory here?
Speaker 3 00:44:58 How about you give us two one's real and one isn't. And no one no one will know until they know
Speaker 2 00:45:01 Ho ho.
Speaker 1 00:45:03 Oh, you can't do that to
Speaker 3 00:45:05 Me. I know you
Speaker 1 00:45:06 Can't do that. 'cause I, I I know, I know the answers And that's, that's the shitty part. 'cause I can't really, I can't, I can't tell you my theories. If I know the answer, I'm gonna say. So
Speaker 2 00:45:17 Give us three then, and then give us a theory on <laugh>. Just kidding, just
Speaker 4 00:45:21 Kidding. I like that. Or give us 10 so that there's a lot of options.
Speaker 1 00:45:25 10. 10. I can easily give you 10. All right. Scarlet Witch, I'm gonna say this. No, hell no. Hell no. No. They can't replicate the powers.
Speaker 4 00:45:35 Here's thing I was gonna say. Wand, here's
Speaker 1 00:45:36 The thing. No, because you cannot have superpowers the thing, but I thought,
Speaker 4 00:45:40 But anyone can learn magic.
Speaker 1 00:45:42 True.
Speaker 3 00:45:43 Maybe. Yeah.
Speaker 4 00:45:44 I on the wand, the scroll train. That would really,
Speaker 1 00:45:47 That'd be Alright. Alex hit
Speaker 2 00:45:48 Us.
Speaker 1 00:45:48 Hit us. So here's the thing. So me being a fan, I would immediately target people who are in positions of power. Not no superheroes, because you can't replicate powers yet. Mm-hmm. You can't replicate powers yet. They they will. I know they're super scrolls and we've already seen the trailer and kind of how it works. But you can't, there's, there's only a limited amount. And I know that there, there no hero that has superpowers.
Speaker 3 00:46:22 So you can do Batman since he's a suit and he doesn't have powers.
Speaker 1 00:46:26 That's a possibility. But here's the other thing. They're going to target people that are in positions of power. Right? I'm talking about people who are in the government. People who are in, in position. So for example, you've got, you've got Ross, you got Ross, you got whoever the president of the United States is. You got, uh, you got Valentina, you got Ross, you got, uh, who else? Um, uh, you've got, this is one of my fe I don't know if this one's one. Uh, Sharon Carter, a hundred percent. Like I'm thinking she could be one. 'cause like her acting again, not again. We don't, we don't even know if they knew, but like the way she immediately drastically changed her character and Falcon in the Winter Soldier, like she was up to some shady shit. You know? What about King Kim? She could be a strong, yeah. A lot of people. I would say people who are in positions of power within the military and government are the main suspects. So, so people like Rodie, you know, that's why it's a popular fan theory. 'cause like, oh, Roddy's in, in this spot and he's in the show. Like, oh my God. Imagine if Roddy was like a scroll. That'd be shocking. Anyways, uh, you know, there's also like people that are in positions. I just think
Speaker 3 00:47:47 Maybe the royal family of Meca or something
Speaker 1 00:47:50 Generals, I don't think they're gonna make, don't think they're gonna make that Royal
Speaker 4 00:47:53 Family has been through enough for the love of God. Leave them alone. <laugh>.
Speaker 1 00:47:58 You know, I, I had, I had a, a 'cause I had a theory about it and I thought about this would be a good way to kind of like reverse depth because that's kind of what they did in the comics. There were characters that were dead for the longest time and then they were brought back because the person that died was a scroll. It happened with Elektra and it, but that person like Elektra was alive. But the Electra that died was a scroll. Mm-hmm. <affirmative>. And I thought about like, if Marvel really wanted to bring a character that's dead, let's say Steve Rogers, let's say Tony starved, this would be the way to do it without it seeming like something that kind of like, uh, that would kind of like diminish what happened in Endgame. But at the same time, I feel like it would, because you have that like, oh, the Tony Stark that we've known for the longest time and then suddenly died and then suddenly it's revealed that he's a scroll.
Speaker 1 00:49:05 It's like, what? Fuck. You know, it's weird. And you also have the same situation with Pepper Potts. Like how do you father a child? <laugh>. But, um, but you know, if Marvel has, if Marvel has any opportunity to make someone scroll, it's one of these three people. It'll be someone that's in a position of power in the government. It has to be someone that does not have superpowers. And third and foremost, it's someone that whose character would have to have been not necessarily dead, but it's a character that people have not liked in the past and decided, you know what, let's change it up. Let's say that this person has been a scroll to make the story interesting because the, the fan appeal for this character just is either non-existent or people don't care enough. You know? So that's kind of like what I would think Marvel would do to determine who's a scroll in this show.
Speaker 4 00:50:01 Yeah, I think it's, I think it's hard to go back and say that people have been a scroll since like phase one because I do feel like it would kind of retroactively ruin things where, you know, those interactions never happened. I was thinking about with Hawkeye, like I feel like the worst thing about Hawkeye is that it would ruin his relationship with Natasha, but at least Natasha's not around anymore. So she can't like be hurt by it <laugh>. Um, and, and I don't mean that happily 'cause I love her, but I don't know it's, I I feel like it would have to be a recent like, replacement if it was a character we know and love so that it doesn't damage the older canon too much. But honestly, after listening to Alex, I really want Val to be a scroll. I feel like Val is the perfect scroll option because a lot of people don't like her.
Speaker 4 00:50:50 I'm not one of them. I love her, but a lot of people don't like her. So I think it would make her much more interesting to those people that like don't find her interesting now. And she is in a position of power. And I just think it would be really cool if she was like, 'cause she's clearly assembling her own team of superheroes. I think it'd be really interesting if she was assembling this team graphic figures out how to make Super Scrolls and then Valve replaces the human members of her team with the super scrolls so that now they have like a Scroll Avengers team that will do whatever she wants. You
Speaker 1 00:51:22 Know what you do, you know what you just reminded me of right now? You literally just reminded me of someone I know is a scroll and it's such a minor character. 'cause we don't even know this character's name, but this character only appeared once and it, and this character's a scroll. And I'm like, do you really expect people to remember what this person was doing and just be like, oh surprise, it's a scroll.
Speaker 4 00:51:43 I feel like I know who you're talking about.
Speaker 1 00:51:45 We don't even know you. You have no idea. I guarantee you you have no,
Speaker 4 00:51:48 Is is, isn't that weird? Like, pasty guy from Age of Ultron who like yelled out when the Ultron bot was coming in and Maria Hills like it?
Speaker 1 00:51:55 No, no, it's not, it's not, it's not him. I, I know I sound like a, like, I know I sound probably like some fricking uh, conspiracy theorist, but listen to me, it's the government because it's not only what happens in the comics, it's what's gonna happen in the show. But there's, uh, I I I keep making faces to like how Udi keeps saying about like, oh, they, this character, they can't be scrolled since phase one. And I keep making these faces 'cause I'm like, Lord, control my tongue <laugh>. Like, I need you to rein it back. I just, I need you to rein my tongue because I
Speaker 4 00:52:34 Feel like there's no way to execute it. While I'm sure that they're gonna do it, but I'm just really worried about it.
Speaker 1 00:52:40 Be worried about that <laugh>.
Speaker 4 00:52:41 Okay.
Speaker 1 00:52:42 You were right to be worried about it. 'cause I got worried about, I got worried about it too. But anyways. Brian,
Speaker 2 00:52:48 Move on. I think that we're gonna skip a few questions just 'cause we're, we're running short on time. I think that this great conversation leads to, to possibly the best segue for this question what do we think the story is going and how do we think it's fundamentally going to change the M c U as we know it, which is a huge one. And Alex has to formulate his his answer first to make sure he doesn't spoil anything. So we're gonna go with him last. Yeah. Um, Anthony, where do you think this story's going? Where do you think it's gonna end? Is there gonna be more deaths? I don't know. Do you? I
Speaker 4 00:53:24 I'm sure someone else
Speaker 3 00:53:24 Is gonna die. I mean, this two, this is obviously really high stakes. It's just not so global that it's, you know, known to everybody in that universe. Mm-hmm. <affirmative>, uh, it's going to change everything. I mean, uh, I'm thinking back to the fact that the Captain America for titled change names from New World Order to Brave New World. And from what we've heard and known it's gonna be about governments kind of duking it out. So how weird is it gonna be watching all these governments duke it out when you can't even trust any of 'em? 'cause who knows who is running what, and they could all be conspiring behind this all together. So, pretty interesting because this is clearly gonna set up a lot more later on.
Speaker 4 00:54:12 Yeah. I feel like Secret Invasion is setting up the movies I'm most excited for, like, in the new phase. Um, 'cause I feel like it's doing a lot of legwork for, yeah, captain America, brave New World, and obviously Thunderbolts because those two movies seem to be pretty connected. Um, but then even Armor Wars, like, I feel like I'm one of the only armor wars, like stands out there. 'cause like no one talks about it because Marvel doesn't talk about it at all. But I
Speaker 1 00:54:39 Feel like we recently only just got info on it. So again, it's like, it's happening, but it's like very, very snail steps. <laugh>.
Speaker 4 00:54:47 Yeah. And it's annoying me that it's going so slow. 'cause I'm like, I feel, I feel like Armor Wars would be such a good, such a good movie if we could like, edit it a little bit faster. 'cause I feel like we're really missing an Avengers movie before King Dynasty. And I've said that in like, some of the articles I've written. And so I feel like Brave New World and Thunderbolts and Armor Wars will all be like that kind of big Avenger style crossover. Like when you mash 'em all together with all the characters that will be appearing between them. And so I feel like Secret Invasion is setting the stage for that in a really interesting way. Even if we don't get any of those heroes in the show. And I know that some heroes have been rumored for the show, like going as far back as like 2020. Um, but again, like even if scrolls just destabilize world governments and throw Earth into like chaos and like distrust and then having that affect Sam so significantly in Brave New World, I feel like if you're gonna go that route, then you don't really need Sam to show up in Secret invasion because the invasion is still going to have a big impact on his life regardless. And so that's what I'm looking forward to seeing.
Speaker 2 00:55:51 Great answer.
Speaker 1 00:55:52 He's in my turn. Is it my turn? Yeah, it's, it's, damn.
Speaker 2 00:55:56 Do you want me to go, you want me to go first?
Speaker 1 00:55:58 Sure, go ahead. Because I still, I'm still working on mine. <laugh>.
Speaker 2 00:56:02 So the hard part about this is, especially being in our line of work, is knowing stuff and then knowing, like having a formulating answer around it. So I understand, I feel your your pain right now, Alex. I think that, well, how this is gonna change going forward is that I think you're gonna see such a dynamic shift in the governmental like world status of the M C U going forward, that nothing's ever gonna be the same. I still think that there's gonna be people who don't trust each other. Nick Fury is gonna probably not trust anybody, um, especially after losing Maria Hill that I think that he's gonna, you know, he's gonna retreat and go to where we see him again in Sabre, um, in the sky because he doesn't want to, he doesn't know who to trust on Earth anymore. So he almost wants to just get off of it.
Speaker 2 00:56:49 So it makes me wonder, is his wife gonna die as well? Because first off, why did he leave his wife? Why is she still on earth? What do we know about her? Nothing. I was always on the boat that I was hoping he was gonna end up with Maria Rambo from Captain Marvel because I thought they had some great chemistry together and now it's someone else, you know? And like, so it's like that, that really is interesting about his wife and why he keeps leaving and is she okay with it? Or how does she factor into that? Um, but I think that the status of the world is going to have changed so much that I cannot wait for Captain America four because it's gonna be totally different. Nothing's gonna look the same. And then even looking forward to like Black Panther three and stuff, the, the world powers are never gonna be the same. So I think that's gonna be how it changes. So fundamentally, M C U and it's not gonna be something we easily recognize. And then it's probably just gonna get all messed up because we're going right into Secret Wars not long after, so it doesn't even matter. Who knows? All right. Did that all enough for you, Alex, to formulate an answer?
Speaker 1 00:57:48 Yeah, so I, I noticed a lot of people, like you guys are just mentioning like the, uh, captain America, uh, there's also, um, thunderbolts and all these projects. I'm surprised no one's mentioned The Marbles since that's a, a complete tie in to it's gonna Secret invasion sets up what's coming in the marbles and it also explains what theory is going to be doing from here on out, especially with, within the context of the Marvels. We know there's been, you know, conversations about what's been going on and, and all that. And it kind of ties into what Theory's been up to. But, um, there's also, for me, what I, what I want, what I'm expecting right now about Secret Invasion is that this show, it has the potential to change things further beyond than any of us ever think. You know, and there is, there is so much that could be affected in this show.
Speaker 1 00:58:56 Like, there's so much that this show is going to change because everything you thought you knew about the M C U could literally be a lie at this point. And I'm talking phase one stuff that you thought, oh, this is like a basic cornerstone of the M C U and it's literally just gonna be, it's like agenda. You, you hit it from the bottom and the damn thing just gonna crumble. You know? And, and this show has the potential to do that. And, and I think that they're gonna go for that route because how do you effectively change the M C U forever if you don't essentially break down what happened before mm-hmm. <affirmative>. So I, I know that this show is going to effectively change not just what we knew, but it's also going to change what's gonna happen moving forward because it is going to be the thing that essentially it's going to be the thing that ushers this sort of event is going to usher in.
Speaker 1 01:00:02 It's going to push things forward that I cannot talk about right now, that I will eventually probably talk about in another podcast when I have the liberty to speak it. But it's going to push certain things to go forward in the M C U and, and push forward into different storylines that, you know, at first, you know, like people kept thinking, how are we ever going to get to this point? And secret invasion is the key point to that. It's going to tackle the street war, the street stories with, you know, uh, captain America Four and Thunderbolts. It's going to affect the cosmic side with the marbles it's gonna hit home with, with armor wars. Uh, it's gonna, it's gonna, and it's gonna affect other projects that haven't been announced yet. And it's really going to be exciting because, because yeah, it's gonna be exciting and, and, and I'm hyped and it sucked and it sucks 'cause I can't talk about it right now, but I know it's gonna be great. <laugh>
Speaker 2 01:01:04 Don't worry, we'll harass you after the we stop recording. I'm just kidding. <laugh>, um, <laugh>.
Speaker 2 01:01:08 So sounds like we're in for a great time. We have five more weeks of this and then we'll be back talking about this again. Uh, so unfortunately we are running outta time, but we'd love to continue the conversation with you listeners. So check us
[email protected] or you can find us on Twitter and other social medias at my Cosmic Circus and also at our Cosmic Circus podcast, Twitter at cosmic podcasts. Thank you again for tuning into the Cosmic Circle. My name is Brian Kitson and you can find me on Twitter at kitson 3 0 1 Uday. Anthony, Alex, thank you so much for joining me. Before we go, can you tell the people where they can find you?
Speaker 4 01:01:41 You can find me on social media at Golden Ninja three.
Speaker 3 01:01:46 You can find me on Twitter at rodo
Speaker 1 01:01:49 And you can find me on Twitter as Alex from cc.
Speaker 2 01:01:53 I can't wait to talk with you guys again. Hopefully we can get you back in five weeks. But thanks again, listeners can't wait to our next trip through the cosmos.
